Im new to the business, but never climbed before. Any advice?

[rico]

Y'all buzzers be freakin' out, running into a plausibly legitimate business person who might be better at business than you or me. We can learn a lot from this guy. We all have strengths and weaknesses. Chill out and let him join in.

Lets remember that this thread started with a guy with zero climbing experience wanting to start a Tree Co, and he was going to be the lead climber. He was gonna take a week-end coarse at Wesspur so everything was gonna be hunky dorry. What could possible go fucking wrong here? At least we have have talked him out of this ridiculous idea, and he is now going to seek out a legit climber, and he will stick to the business end of things. I would call that a win folks, so I for one encourage him to chase his tree dream. He will soon find that the bank aint gonna be rollin in as quickly as he thinks, but it sound like he is in it for the long haul. I for one wish him luck!

 

[SomethingWitty]

I was paying $1100 a year for my general liability, and that was 1 mil coverage.
Any cheaper than that is pretty mind blowing. They certainly didn't allow monthly payments.

 

[islandarb]

Like treevet? Too bad he left the buzz.

David Shaw was a good guy in my books.

 

[RopeShield]

David Shaw was a good guy in my books.

 

[islandarb]

You are good to go rope. Even if I do not see eye to eye all the time. Hell I even miss Jomoco and his trigger spurs....lol

 

[Jorgon1022]

Probably not, it's not personal though. The way I was raised in work was to never ask someone to do what you cannot do yourself, the boss is supposed to be the best at every aspect of the work, or at least experienced in it. That way you are never really depending on others and if someone is having lackluster performance you can tell them to step aside while you show them how it's done! Otherwise you just look like a clown and people will not respect you, that's been my experience.

My boss was a project manager that managed mathematicians and software engineers. He was someone that never went to college and sure as hell didnt know the first thing about coding.

He knew he couldnt do what these people could. He never told them how to do the job, all he knew was what he wanted the end product to look like.

Similarly, I would never tell a climber how to do his job. I would give him free reign and help and support him any way that I could so he could get the job done in a safe and efficient manner.

 

[Jorgon1022]

Sam started on a 3:1 with me hauling him for his 7th bday. He was so keen That after maybe 3 times like this I decided to move him onto SRT with a wrench and foot/knee ascenders using a chestie to tend system. Been at it like this for 6 months.

Thats awesome. I feel kids learn faster simply because the flexibility is there. They are more nimble and I sometimes think that less scared of risks.

 

[rico]

You are good to go rope. Even if I do not see eye to eye all the time. Hell I even miss Jomoco and his trigger spurs....lol

You guys ever seen Jomoco's posts over at Arboristsite? Dude is a serious lunatic and a poet to boot. I used to get a kick out of reading his posts over there before I was banned for life.

 

[MikePowers321]

@swingdude thats literally what im trying to do. Arrogance would be me thinking I dont need any help from any of you.

I joined this forum because I recognize I dont know shit and need to learn. I literally mentioned all the ISA courses I am taking to learn about tree anatomy, biology, climbing, safety standards, etc. Sure, a few courses wont make me an expert, but im trying to take initiative in learning.

How am I displaying arrogance? I know that I cant learn to climb in 3 days. But taking a tree climbing course is a good start and better than nothing isnt it?

And thats great about your son man. I hope I can do what hes doing asap lol. How long would you say it took him to go unaided if you dont mind me asking?

There is nothing like true experience in this occupation. There are so many unseen scenarios you may find yourself in that can be dangerous to people and property. Trying to run a business (paperwork, estimates, maintenance, back end work) while also trying to learn the work from scratch is going to be extremely challenging and will ultimately slow your growth as an arborist. There is simply so much the mind can absorb at once. I believe psychologists will call this your "cognitive load" I would recommend taking the time to work under a professional and build a true foundation. You can learn soo much this way. Invaluable really. Best to you.

 

[islandarb]

I swear Mike most folks I come in contact with, the layperson thinks arbwork is just unskilled labor. My biggest insult I recieve is " you are a tree trimmer? ".... WTF... hair is trimmed and trees are pruned.....might be splitting hairs for most but not I. Arboriculture is a huge discipline. It's knowledge vast and we can never know it all or enough. Chainsaw work is a small part of the big picture.

 

[southsoundtree]

$15/ hour is about the average for a tree worker there, maybe, not an arborist. Not an arborist, crew leader, lead climber. Not a chance.

$10/ hour and meth, maybe.

Boise is a dry, mountainous climate. Trees are smaller there overall, probably.

Cottonwoods are serious biz, heavy and decay-prone. Aspen, likely to barberchair.

You might scour the archives for a climber/ company in your area.

https://www.google.com/search?q=boi...rome..69i57.5045j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Don't expect someone to slit their own throat. That's searching Boise. You might try Spokane or elsewhere.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Henry Ford wasn't a machinist or mechanical engineer. He did understand how to streamline processes. He hired people who could do what he couldn't and managed the work process and output. There are dividing points in the work structure. At those divisions we'll sometimes see a person who understands what's going on up and down from their place. That doesn't make them less important.

 

[islandarb]

Henry Ford wasn't a machinist or mechanical engineer. He did understand how to streamline processes. He hired people who could do what he couldn't and managed the work process and output. There are dividing points in the work structure. At those divisions we'll sometimes see a person who understands what's going on up and down from their place. That doesn't make them less important.

Tom you are gaining my attention.

 

[Jorgon1022]

Henry Ford wasn't a machinist or mechanical engineer. He did understand how to streamline processes. He hired people who could do what he couldn't and managed the work process and output. There are dividing points in the work structure. At those divisions we'll sometimes see a person who understands what's going on up and down from their place. That doesn't make them less important.

Im glad someone understands what im trying to do lol. Its literally about building processes and having a business run like a well oiled machine.

Thats my vision for my company.

 

[Crimsonking]

What are the current problems you see that you have solutions for? How do you plan to streamline your operations? What framework have you constructed through which the business will flow? What company structures/models have you studied and hope to employ?

I’m not grilling, but someone coming into an industry seeing opportunity to make bank has ideas and has observed a sweet spot that has not been capitalized on. I’m genuinely curious about your plan and angle.

 

[evo]

My boss was a project manager that managed mathematicians and software engineers. He was someone that never went to college and sure as hell didnt know the first thing about coding.

He knew he couldnt do what these people could. He never told them how to do the job, all he knew was what he wanted the end product to look like.

Similarly, I would never tell a climber how to do his job. I would give him free reign and help and support him any way that I could so he could get the job done in a safe and efficient manner.

That’s cool and all, but you can’t really kill yourself or others coding. Sure you could cause some atms to blow cash out into the streets causing riots, but no code is going to fell a tree backwards onto a orphanage.

You need to know what is a good climber, and what is a safe climber. How are you going to learn to judge that? Not YouTube and certainly not a few climbing work shops (most attend because they are learning)..

The main reason why so many of the guys are flicking you shit, is being a good tree man, Arborist, tree woman, climber, and what not is an art. It is a NEVER ending skill development process, and a life style to many. That is your first and most important piece of business advice, now you know what the salt and Pepper is of a good climber. Alas still doesn’t mean they are worth a shit up in the tree.

To some pruning is the hardest aspect of treework to learn. There is a eye and a feel for it which cannot be taught. Removals (are very challenging in their own right) but I feel that with enough practice and effort most can develop the skills needed.

It’s pretty common to pay your dues on the ground for a minimum of a year before any real climbing takes place. Sure some just jump in the saddle, but there is certainly something to be said for grounding for a year.

The $15 an hour thing is bull shit, any climber worth half a shit would walk for that. Sure some will take a tree down for a 6 pack, but not exactly your quality employee. Around here a climber that is good enough to occasionally run a crew for simpler jobs is about $30+ with bennies. No bennies and a rockstar well your looking north of $40-50.

 

[Jorgon1022]

That’s cool and all, but you can’t really kill yourself or others coding. Sure you could cause some atms to blow cash out into the streets causing riots, but no code is going to fell a tree backwards onto a orphanage.

You need to know what is a good climber, and what is a safe climber. How are you going to learn to judge that? Not YouTube and certainly not a few climbing work shops (most attend because they are learning)..

The main reason why so many of the guys are flicking you shit, is being a good tree man, Arborist, tree woman, climber, and what not is an art. It is a NEVER ending skill development process, and a life style to many. That is your first and most important piece of business advice, now you know what the salt and Pepper is of a good climber. Alas still doesn’t mean they are worth a shit up in the tree.

To some pruning is the hardest aspect of treework to learn. There is a eye and a feel for it which cannot be taught. Removals (are very challenging in their own right) but I feel that with enough practice and effort most can develop the skills needed.

It’s pretty common to pay your dues on the ground for a minimum of a year before any real climbing takes place. Sure some just jump in the saddle, but there is certainly something to be said for grounding for a year.

The $15 an hour thing is bull shit, any climber worth half a shit would walk for that. Sure some will take a tree down for a 6 pack, but not exactly your quality employee. Around here a climber that is good enough to occasionally run a crew for simpler jobs is about $30+ with bennies. No bennies and a rockstar well your looking north of $40-50.

You missed the whole point of my comment Evo.
He stated that he didnt respect someone that hasnt done the job. Im stating that you can respect such a person even if they dont know as much as you do.

 

[evo]

You missed the whole point of my comment Evo.
He stated that he didnt respect someone that hasnt done the job. Im stating that you can respect such a person even if they dont know as much as you do.

Ok, but it doesn’t make my words any less true. I commend you for putting in the effort to learn.

Personally to be blunt I’m a little skeptical, of a any tree company that is solely in it for money. Sure there are quite a few outfits which operate this way, but I can say their work is crap, and their tactics are criminal (maybe not illegal).

So answer this question and you might get more warmth from this community. Why trees? Why do you want to make money by starting a tree company?

 

[Jorgon1022]

What are the current problems you see that you have solutions for? How do you plan to streamline your operations? What framework have you constructed through which the business will flow? What company structures/models have you studied and hope to employ?

I’m not grilling, but someone coming into an industry seeing opportunity to make bank has ideas and has observed a sweet spot that has not been capitalized on. I’m genuinely curious about your plan and angle.

Sure. I will give you a couple of ideas that I have observed. First of all, customer service is horrid. Around my area tree guys are booked roughly 2-3 months in advance. Most dont work weekends and believe it or not a lot of them arent able to present proof of insurance.


How do I know this? I spent months gathering data on my competition. Months.

In addition to this how can I differentiate myself? Being presentable and clean cut, always answering my phone and always being on time is what I am focusing on. A lot of you may laugh at this but psychologists have proved that doing these things make a difference. Perception is everything whether we like it or not.

One last thing, and I am still gathering data in my area about this. I am trying to niche down and focus on tree work within certain parameters.

Some ideas are focusing on trees 50 feet and under, cutting the tree and not worrying about the stump, etc.

Some of you may say "But Jorgon, that is the stupidest shit I have ever heard. lol. Youre gonna fail bro. You have to be able to be all things to all clients you dumbass. Youre gonna tell a customer that you dont do stump grinding? lol."

Niching down allows me to focus on those customers, it allows me to only buy the machinery necessary to do those jobs, and allows me to cut down custs, streamline those jobs, and build processes around those jobs.

 

[Jorgon1022]

Ok, but it doesn’t make my words any less true. I commend you for putting in the effort to learn.

Personally to be blunt I’m a little skeptical, of a any tree company that is solely in it for money. Sure there are quite a few outfits which operate this way, but I can say their work is crap, and their tactics are criminal (maybe not illegal).

So answer this question and you might get more warmth from this community. Why trees? Why do you want to make money by starting a tree company?

Trees are high ticket items. You have to atleast appreciate my honesty. I could have told you guys that its because I have a passion for trees and love them but I didnt. I see an opportunity, I feel that my business will be able to help people in my area, and I just want to capitalize on it.

In regards to my tactics being criminal and my work being crap, that is something I will avoid at all costs.

I am of the mindset that if I were to do shitty work, the word would spread and my business would fail. Why even start something like this if I plan to screw people over? Thats not who I am or how I operate.

I also feel that many here think I plan to get rich quick. I really dont. This is a 5 year plan and I am just starting out.