UK. Two ropes at all times(USA next?)

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DSMc said:
My observation is that people that fear base ties are the ones with little experience using them. Tons of safety when used to their potential. Even low stretch ropes produce vastly reduced shock and trauma when doubled in length.
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Agreed, but as far as rope cut accidents go I would put this pretty high on the list as it involves others onsite doing the damage..
 
If you look carefully at their entire routing potential, there are so many ways to mitigate a base tie being cut. It becomes more obvious when you have used them for awhile.

And we are always tied in twice whilst cutting, right?
 
DSMc said:
If you look carefully at their entire routing potential, there are so many ways to mitigate a base tie being cut. It becomes more obvious when you have used them for awhile.

And we are always tied in twice whilst cutting, right?
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Sure - this was discussed heavily in another thread some months ago. Just noting that if the situation was to occur I can see it happening there, only if climber was not lanyarded in such as ascent, or changeover.
 
evo said:
It’s really all about the anchors. Can anyone show me a fatality from a climbing line failure? Once you exclude the fact one should have been tied in twice while using a saw. And then exclude tip failures, or tree failures what’s left? Sure one could have a bomber tip and take one higher up leaving the bomber as a backup.
However, most cases if your working twin line (around here in conifer land) two independent tips is a pita to set from the ground, and if set base anchored your tip breaks out you don’t have far to go till the next limb
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Now that makes sense,well said!Recent developements in tree climbig have made the work safer,and more efficient.Developing better techniques for working on two ropes included!Requiring two ropes on every climb is a step backwards!
 
Wrangler said:
Now that makes sense,well said!Recent developements in tree climbig have made the work safer,and more efficient.Developing better techniques for working on two ropes included!Requiring two ropes on every climb is a step backwards!
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The title of this thread is “Two Ropes At All Times (Is USA Next?) my question is who would make us next? Would it be OSHA? ANSI? For anyone opposed to this that wants to be proactive and make sure it doesn’t happen here the first step would be rallying support and getting representation .When and where is this topic going to be brought up, is it soon ? If so are the people representing our industry for or against this idea?
 
It would seem a longshot for z133 to make two ropes mandatory at all times,but could OSHA come up with a regulation that would make this mandatory? Again i love using two tip sometimes even a third, and the R and D is great,Thank You to the people doing it! I just don’t want to be forced to do it on every tree!
 
Wrangler said:
The title of this thread is “Two Ropes At All Times (Is USA Next?) my question is who would make us next? Would it be OSHA? ANSI? For anyone opposed to this that wants to be proactive and make sure it doesn’t happen here the first step would be rallying support and getting representation .When and where is this topic going to be brought up, is it soon ? If so are the people representing our industry for or against this idea?
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Eh. I'll just follow the rules that appeal to me. That's what I do now.
 
In the new world of 'fear' we live in. Where helicopter parenting and fear programming is spreading like the plaque to all areas of life. It is sad to say, but regulation is going to be the inevitable. Especially with the amount of injury and death in the field. Be it ANSI, OSHA, or insurance companies as a whole banding together and refusing to cover people and/or accidents caused by people who don't play by their rules. On both the professional liablility side, health/safety side, and the homeowner coverage side.

I think the best possible thing we can do is to participate in the conversation leading up to it and try to steer it in a direction that might actually work for everyone involved. If we don't challenge for compromise on their end we will end up with only what they want. As you are seeing with this new regulation in UK, where the citizens/workers didn't/don't have a voice.

There's a lot to be learned from the rope access community. SPRAT does good things for their industry and has saved a lot of life since its inception. What I like about them is my understanding that they are a nonprofit conglomeration of rope access professionals who got together to do just that. Key word being nonprofit. That being said they work in an entirely different environment with an entirely different set of risks and hazards. With an entirely different scope of work, with an entirely different client base, mostly all large corporations with bottomless pockets.

That being said, despite the lives they've saved and the good they've done, we don't want them writing our rule book. Yet, as a group of professionals in their field, they got together and wrote their own. That's where we can learn from them. I'd much rather see regulations dictating work practices and safety of tree workers be written by the yet nonexistant Society of Professional TREE Access Technicians! A nonprofit group of tree access professionals banding together and writing their own rules.

We currently have little say in the regulatory world because we as individuals have little voice. Choose not to participate in 'their.' Fighting the inevitable tooth and nail till the point that it is too late. Don't want ridiculous regulation written by people who don't know any better, NOW is the time to get together and make your voice known. Just remember it will be a compromise. Regulation will happen, it is the inevitable, and certain parts of it you likely won't like. Perhaps we can make our voices heard and mitigate some of the worst of it into something workable.
 
rico said:
Classic. A tool built for a specific industry that said industry won't allow its workers to use. Fear seems to be the guiding force these days?
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Fear is right, fear of lawsuits. It is mostly all about companies being afraid of getting sued. Remove the bloody lawyers from the equation and all this BS largely vanishes. A further irony is this same fear of liability kills lots of innovation in industry where people are not willing to take a chance introducing a new idea, and many of these ideas that never happen might have made things safer.
 
climbstihl said:
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Thanks man,ive actually been experimenting (with two wrenches)
Advantages ive found so far
1) i can use a super high tip with basal anchor that otherwise may be out of the question because of smallish wood and inability to inspect from ground
If im backed up ,not an issue
2)on multi stemmed trees,super tall co-doms,or wide spreading canopys the time to install other system is made up for once your aloft because it takes seconds now to access parts of the tree noo wheres near your tip
The bad
1) ascent is slowed because you have to tend other hitch and manuver it around interfearing limbs
2)very tiresome and aggravating in brushy trees
3)gets in way of rigging
 
Wrangler said:
1) ascent is slowed because you have to tend other hitch and manuver it around interfearing limbs
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I know my Akimbo would just follow me up, as long as there are no limbs of course. I would imagine a runner or bone to do the same. It'll be much harder to manage a wrench and a mechanical at the same time though.
 
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