Trying to come up with an production incentive program

[MO_treeguy]

So the boss asked if I had any ideas on a fair incentive program that would help motivate going above and beyond. We’ve tossed around a few ideas but find problems with the couple we have come up with. We struggle with feet dragging and a couple guys need the hours but don’t want to get/ask for more work. We have 3 crews 1 is a powerhouse crew that tackles the big money jobs they average bringing in around $2700 daily. The 2nd crew works on the medium/small jobs averaging $2k daily, the 3rd crew is a floating crew that completes the unfinished jobs, small jobs and rental properties, afterwards goes to help one of the other two crews. We have 4 climbers, 10 ground guys and usually the ground guys float from crew to crew due to call ins. So it’d be difficult I’d think to have a per crew incentive with the daily changes and trying to track the crew assignments. If we did a company incentive of hitting a weekly goal altogether we’re not sure if there’d be issues if one crew jammed out their work and one had a tough week of issues would arise. Anyone have feedback or ideas of an incentive policy they have or wish they had, that benefits everyone?


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[flushcut]

Have the guy who signs the checks show up more often on the job site and linger around for a bit.
No one is going to want to take on more work you have to motivate them financially. You get X job done faster than the estimate you get a cash bonus. And if that doesn’t work maybe you need to find different crew members or mix up the personalities.

 

[Stuby1]

So the boss asked if I had any ideas on a fair incentive program that would help motivate going above and beyond. We’ve tossed around a few ideas but find problems with the couple we have come up with. We struggle with feet dragging and a couple guys need the hours but don’t want to get/ask for more work. We have 3 crews 1 is a powerhouse crew that tackles the big money jobs they average bringing in around $2700 daily. The 2nd crew works on the medium/small jobs averaging $2k daily, the 3rd crew is a floating crew that completes the unfinished jobs, small jobs and rental properties, afterwards goes to help one of the other two crews. We have 4 climbers, 10 ground guys and usually the ground guys float from crew to crew due to call ins. So it’d be difficult I’d think to have a per crew incentive with the daily changes and trying to track the crew assignments. If we did a company incentive of hitting a weekly goal altogether we’re not sure if there’d be issues if one crew jammed out their work and one had a tough week of issues would arise. Anyone have feedback or ideas of an incentive policy they have or wish they had, that benefits everyone?


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Whatever you decide, you have to look at peak production and not over stretching while trying to hone in on an incentive plan. That’s when shortcuts occur and likely it’s cousin…injuries.


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[Dan Cobb]

An incentive program "that benefits everyone" sounds like extra pay. I believe you only want to reward desired behaviors and results. If the ground guys are floating from crew to crew due to call ins, a penalty for poor attendance should be part of the incentive program. You need to decide on what other measurable items are important and add them to the program. Safety and property protection may need to be components, lest they suffer to achieve production goals. If you have people dragging their feet, that might be better addressed through more punitive actions, as working is a baseline expectation of employment. Or at least have a certain (low) number of "feet dragging infractions" during the period knock an employee out of the incentive for the period or reduce their share; crew leaders will need to document such infractions because employees are likely to challenge being left out of the incentive. With the variable nature of tree work, measuring productivity is difficult. Actual hours versus estimated hours may be the most practical way, but may not average out to a true picture of productivity if done on a weekly basis. Be careful not to reward baseline job expectations. Just giving "spot awards" for going above and beyond could be an alternative to a formal incentive program. Good luck.

 

[RyanCafferky]

Humans respond better to rewards than punitive measures. Maybe people are more motivated by time with their families/friends than work and more money. Deep dives into people's goals, motivations, and who they are will help decide how to structure crews and how to motivate those teams.

 

[Crimsonking]

A friend finally landed on a plan that is working for his team. I don’t know the details, but everyone seems happy with it. I can put you in touch if you’d like.

Edit-

His teams are fixed, though. It does sound like you may have an issue that needs resolved in guys calling out.

If you have core guys on each team that are consistent, give them a production bonus that they can disseminate among the people they felt contributed to their team’s profitability for the week. The guys not getting anything will start asking questions or start walking.

 

[Reach]

We have a somewhat unique system that gives the crew monthly, performance-based bonuses. I would be willing to share more details in a private message or a phone conversation with you, but I’ll give a few of the high points here.

At the end of every month, we take a significant portion of the profits for that month and divide them up between the crew. Each crewmember is given a numerical rating for their performance that month, and we have a formula that converts all of those ratings to a percentage of the total monthly bonus. By doing it this way, it incentivizes the crewmembers to kick it up a notch to try to get into the higher percentage brackets, and it gives the other high performers a little bit of incentive to push the low performers into doing better or moving on to somewhere else.

 

[MO_treeguy]

So an attendance bonus was implemented not too long ago to help with the call ins. Each person has $500 in each pot, if you call in that morning, you lose $100. Payout of that bonus is once a year. As far as gear or work wear, company pays for it so for that kinda incentives are difficult. Safety incentives prevent guys reporting incidents/accidents. Saturday work ground guys get a $100+OT if you have the hours, climbers $175+ot if you have the hours. The goal with a production incentive is everyone trying to step up and go the extra mile, there’s a few guys that are self motivated and are paid way above the average in our area because it seems it’s harder and harder to find good employees.


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[Tom Dunlap]

If you have core guys on each team that are consistent, give them a production bonus that they can disseminate among the people they felt contributed to their team’s profitability for the week. The guys not getting anything will start asking questions or start walking.

That sort of scheme sounds like it would create bad morale. Perceived favoritism real or not, is a bad thing.

There have been some reasonable incentive programs shared on TreeBuzz.com. They took time to tweak and fine-tune. I'd suggest not trying to create one on your own. Keep asking and you'll find someone, like @Reach who is willing to help out. there are so many variables to account for to have a real incentive program that employees can get behind.

At one company Ii worked for the crews were expected to meet dollars/hour production ratios. If the crew missed the ration they were held responsible. This created tension between production adn sales.

ONe day I was checking in a crew and used half of my hearing to listen to anothe super check in another crew. When the number crunch was done they missed the ratio and the other super really started to bite their butts. I remembered their work hours and billed job dollars. When I got home I did the numbers to find out how much clock time they missed. It was a three man crew in one truck and it worked out to be mere minutes. I wanted to convert that time to some real thing. It turned out it was about how long a missed left turn at a busy intersection would take to hav all four roads go through their cycles. Sheesh! THe crew misses a light and they get gigged?! I knew the crew too. They did great work and made money for the company. On the sly I told them to bring their checkins to me. I wouldn't fudge numbers but I wasn't going to come down on them because production was off by fractions of a percentage. The other super was a bully and was demoralizing. Be careful

 

[climbingmonkey24]

So I have a thought a little different from monetary rewards.

Have you considered hosting company activities / outings where your employees get a chance to bond and strengthen their relationships outside of the workplace setting?

Here’s what I have found. When you work with great people and have fun doing it, production goes up, people want to show up to work, etc. Tree work is a team effort when you work on a crew.

As I only have one employee I really can’t speak much about this compared to some of the other people here who are dealing with multiple employees.

But I think a system that focuses on bringing everyone together as a team while also maybe including those monetary rewards / benefits in there that have been talked about, could be valuable.

 

[Mike Islander]

"Hard-Charger One Hundred". $100 a week goes to one of your employees. Targets a special effort instead of overall performance, since your top guys will always average higher. Your lower tier guys need positive reinforcement. Allows you to mold performance, and your lesser performers will soon recognize exactly what types of actions you value. Frequent enough to get everyone involved.

Made up the name. You are welcome to use it. If that is too much money, "Fantastic Fifty", "Top Tier Twenty Five", etc.

Reward it every Friday in front of everyone. Explain what they guy did to EARN it. Thank him publicly. All his mates will then demand he buy the beer that afternoon.

 

[Sfoppema]

IMO, the crew is not responsible for profit. The crew's job is to go out and do what can be reasonably expected of them, in style and in good spirit, ideally. The business is responsible for profit. If a salesman is underbidding and the crew can't reasonably "meet the profit margin for the day", that is not the fault of the crew.. If the salesman is overbidding, and profit is over on a job, that really isn't the crew's doing either, and I see no reason to reward them for it. Coming up with an incentive plan to get people to do more than can be reasonably expected, sounds unreasonable.


I run a 4-5 person crew that I am typically present on. I have a contract climber 4 days a week (2 different guys each two days/wk), a really hard working ground guy/novice climber/mechanically minded individual capable of fixing many things...., and one to two less seasoned ground guys. I don't expect anyone to do anything that they aren't comfortable doing, and typically take care of the stuff that no one else wants to do... It works out very well and aside from the occasional issues, team moral is typically high.
As climbing monkey said, people want to like what they are doing. Real hard working folks will feel that the bonus is the fun that was had working as a team and getting things done in style and good spirit, particularly if they know they are being compensated well for their efforts. If they think they should be making more money, or that an unreasonable amount of work has been put in front of them for the day, team moral is not going to be good. As a boss, you should ask yourself if you are fairly compensating your guys. You should ask yourself if your guys get along. Is there a bad apple? Moral is everything, and sometimes you have to get rid of the people that are messing with it. Often the boss is the one messing with it....

Great workers should be paid well and this behavior should be a baseline. The idea of expecting a bonus for hard work just doesn't do it for me. I do give people bonuses when I know that they sacrificed extra time or effort for the good of the group (ie homeowner adds a few things at the end and everyone is already gearing down as their job was thought to be done. Always a kick in the pants to have to drag your ass up another tree for a branch or two). I understand that this sucks, and they respect me for appreciating it if they agree to help finish off the job. I would never make them do anything. If they wouldn't do it, I would.

I think just paying people well and putting them in a positive "reasonable expectation" environment is the key. Weed out the shitbags and don't expect people to make money for you, just expect them to do tree work. Don't ask for a bonus ask for a raise, and when you ask for the raise, you should have a good reason if they ask you "why?"

A little bit of a rant... apologies and cheers

 

[lumberjackson]

Some great insights here. I've thought about this for a long time and haven't even gotten close to the ideas here. Thanks for sharing. I agree that hard work and good attitude should be baseline, but I think those are very subjective and mean different things to different guys. We want a way to inspire all the guys on the crew to do their best work and be their best selves, like Ryan and Climbingmonkey pointed to.

Absolutely agree with sfoppema about profit being the business' responsibility, and Tom also mentioning perceived favoritism. @Reach I am super curious about the rating system you use, like what criteria do you use to build their rating, and who actually assigns the rating to each crew member. @Sfoppema if you ever get to a point where you no longer work with your crew, do you have any thoughts on how you could encourage your guys to step into the role you currently have of taking care of the stuff that nobody wants to do?

 

[Reach]

Some great insights here. I've thought about this for a long time and haven't even gotten close to the ideas here. Thanks for sharing. I agree that hard work and good attitude should be baseline, but I think those are very subjective and mean different things to different guys. We want a way to inspire all the guys on the crew to do their best work and be their best selves, like Ryan and Climbingmonkey pointed to.

Absolutely agree with sfoppema about profit being the business' responsibility, and Tom also mentioning perceived favoritism. @Reach I am super curious about the rating system you use, like what criteria do you use to build their rating, and who actually assigns the rating to each crew member. @Sfoppema if you ever get to a point where you no longer work with your crew, do you have any thoughts on how you could encourage your guys to step into the role you currently have of taking care of the stuff that nobody wants to do?

The rating system is pretty simple, it’s a rating from 1-3. Most will earn a 2, that’s pretty standard. A 1 is earned by showing up late regularly, not showing any effort, not showing up at all, or other things such as that. A 3 is earned by over performing. Showing up early/staying late to prep trucks or sweep up the shop, maybe upselling some customers, just generally acting like a rockstar.

Currently I am the one who assigns the ratings, as we are a small company and I am the only one who can make those decisions.

 

[OasisTree]

IMO, the crew is not responsible for profit. The crew's job is to go out and do what can be reasonably expected of them, in style and in good spirit, ideally. The business is responsible for profit. If a salesman is underbidding and the crew can't reasonably "meet the profit margin for the day", that is not the fault of the crew.. If the salesman is overbidding, and profit is over on a job, that really isn't the crew's doing either, and I see no reason to reward them for it. Coming up with an incentive plan to get people to do more than can be reasonably expected, sounds unreasonable.


I run a 4-5 person crew that I am typically present on. I have a contract climber 4 days a week (2 different guys each two days/wk), a really hard working ground guy/novice climber/mechanically minded individual capable of fixing many things...., and one to two less seasoned ground guys. I don't expect anyone to do anything that they aren't comfortable doing, and typically take care of the stuff that no one else wants to do... It works out very well and aside from the occasional issues, team moral is typically high.
As climbing monkey said, people want to like what they are doing. Real hard working folks will feel that the bonus is the fun that was had working as a team and getting things done in style and good spirit, particularly if they know they are being compensated well for their efforts. If they think they should be making more money, or that an unreasonable amount of work has been put in front of them for the day, team moral is not going to be good. As a boss, you should ask yourself if you are fairly compensating your guys. You should ask yourself if your guys get along. Is there a bad apple? Moral is everything, and sometimes you have to get rid of the people that are messing with it. Often the boss is the one messing with it....

Great workers should be paid well and this behavior should be a baseline. The idea of expecting a bonus for hard work just doesn't do it for me. I do give people bonuses when I know that they sacrificed extra time or effort for the good of the group (ie homeowner adds a few things at the end and everyone is already gearing down as their job was thought to be done. Always a kick in the pants to have to drag your ass up another tree for a branch or two). I understand that this sucks, and they respect me for appreciating it if they agree to help finish off the job. I would never make them do anything. If they wouldn't do it, I would.

I think just paying people well and putting them in a positive "reasonable expectation" environment is the key. Weed out the shitbags and don't expect people to make money for you, just expect them to do tree work. Don't ask for a bonus ask for a raise, and when you ask for the raise, you should have a good reason if they ask you "why?"

A little bit of a rant... apologies and cheers

Very well said, and I do appreciate the insight. Bid the jobs right, and make sure your guys know you have their back. Encourage teamwork, and do your best to eliminate frustrations on the job!

 

[Sfoppema]

if you ever get to a point where you no longer work with your crew, do you have any thoughts on how you could encourage your guys to step into the role you currently have of taking care of the stuff that nobody wants to do?

Thats the tricky part. My best thought so far considering my company, from a theoretical standpoint, would be to send a second crew to "easy" jobs where it looks like nothing will put a bee in anyone's bonnet. Doesn't fully solve that problem, but creates a situation where I could expand in the meantime....

This is just from my situation, using "contract climbers" often..
The contract guys wouldn't be able to "run a crew" or drive trucks because they are just there for the day, and as I mentioned before, they aren't there to make money for you, they are there to do tree work. Even if there was nothing else required of them, I could see it turning into a problem. Very good guys, but can be sensitive, especially if they see or think that additional responsibility is being put on them. Have to handle them a certain way or they will get upset and moral and productivity can get upset.... I use these guys a lot and have thought using them as a crew leader would be a logical solution to the question you've posed. For simple jobs where my very dependable ground guy meets them on the job and tells them what to do, it works great. Not with the guys I have used. They are awesome tree guys btw I don't hold anything against them, just mentioning what I've seen over the years with using them.... Using it as a full time solution for every job wouldn't work. The human element shows up big time when you try to turn your theories into reality.

As for finding/hiring someone to take that position..... Might be able to offer a self employed small company guy enough money to come on board who likes the work, but is overwhelmed by selling work/business side of things. Someone who has been on/seen the ownership side of things would be best suited for that task. Or if hiring from within, maybe would have to offer them enough money, or a percentage of profit with the expectation that they will fill this role, assuming they have the experience, skillset, and leadership qualities to reliably and safely do so. A trial period would be a good idea. As long as the terms and expectations are clear and both parties are happy with them that could work..

Haven't gotten there yet, but most importantly, you'd have to be willing to pay them well.

Any outfits who have already solved this problem out there? I assume that bigger companies with 3+ crews have this figured out, but I have really only worked for small companies including my own....

 

[MO_treeguy]

[mention]Sfoppema [/mention]I agree with a lot of what you said. Our situation currently, the guys that are solid are paid well above what most are making in the area. Example top climber is making $40 an hour, top ground guy is making $23 insurance and retirement included. The average in the area $25-30 for the top climber, ground guy $16-20. Our lowest paid climber/ground guy is on average pay with benefits that most don’t offer. The crews get the work that’s assigned to them done, that’s not the issue. The issue is incentivizing if you get the scheduled work done earlier than anticipated and asking for another job to go bust out instead of shutting down or dragging ass on the last job longer than needed.

[mention]Reach [/mention] i like the idea of the ranking system, only question is have is when demoted a ranking, what’s the attitude like? We’re talking about a highly ego guys that will at times think they do no wrong lol Does the ranking system fluctuate week to week?

[mention]climbingmonkey24 [/mention] as far as company gatherings we have tried multiple different avenues to get guys together. We’ve done ax throwing, rock climbing and golf, about half the guys will show up. The other half i think have the mindset of i see you enough throughout the week, I’ll go be with my family instead. Which is totally understandable. It’s just hard to get 16 guys together with a common interest/hobby.


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[Reach]

[mention]Sfoppema [/mention]I agree with a lot of what you said. Our situation currently, the guys that are solid are paid well above what most are making in the area. Example top climber is making $40 an hour, top ground guy is making $23 insurance and retirement included. The average in the area $25-30 for the top climber, ground guy $16-20. Our lowest paid climber/ground guy is on average pay with benefits that most don’t offer. The crews get the work that’s assigned to them done, that’s not the issue. The issue is incentivizing if you get the scheduled work done earlier than anticipated and asking for another job to go bust out instead of shutting down or dragging ass on the last job longer than needed.

[mention]Reach [/mention] i like the idea of the ranking system, only question is have is when demoted a ranking, what’s the attitude like? We’re talking about a highly ego guys that will at times think they do no wrong lol Does the ranking system fluctuate week to week?

[mention]climbingmonkey24 [/mention] as far as company gatherings we have tried multiple different avenues to get guys together. We’ve done ax throwing, rock climbing and golf, about half the guys will show up. The other half i think have the mindset of i see you enough throughout the week, I’ll go be with my family instead. Which is totally understandable. It’s just hard to get 16 guys together with a common interest/hobby.


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The ratings are by the month, and they’re kept private. I don’t share them with anyone, the only way someone can figure out their rating is by comparing their bonus with that of the others on the crew, and nobody likes to share their paycheck.

 

[Basswood]

The main issue is commitment.

Either do one or don’t bother.

Another is team vs individual. We have a team based one and it’s pretty silly. We hit it a lot but miss a lot too. Mostly this isn’t a production issue but a sales issue. Having both set in place would probably be the best way.

I love seeing companies do daily type giveaways and little friendly competitions for newer gear. Seems like a great way to keep moral up.

 

[lumberjackson]

"Hard-Charger One Hundred". $100 a week goes to one of your employees. Targets a special effort instead of overall performance, since your top guys will always average higher. Your lower tier guys need positive reinforcement. Allows you to mold performance, and your lesser performers will soon recognize exactly what types of actions you value. Frequent enough to get everyone involved.

Made up the name. You are welcome to use it. If that is too much money, "Fantastic Fifty", "Top Tier Twenty Five", etc.

Reward it every Friday in front of everyone. Explain what they guy did to EARN it. Thank him publicly. All his mates will then demand he buy the beer that afternoon.

What about some sort of combination of this and Reach's rating system. Each employee has a chance to recognize/nominate the "above and beyond" efforts that they noticed or benefitted from by one (or more) of their co-workers during the day/week/month. Then the guys who got nominated by their coworkers get some public recognition, and the number/magnitude of nominations others wrote about them influences their bonus? Giving nominations could be private (on a notecard that goes in a locked box, written in a notes section on their timecard) or public (on a sticky note stuck on the person's locker, on a whiteboard with columns for each employee) to give a little bit of a competitive feeling to try to get the most nominations.

It is a step removed from the boss assigning all the ratings, which might help avoid perceived favoritism, but also might give you as the boss less control over "exactly what types of actions you value" and reward. The nominations could be vetted by the boss before they're recognized. I think it has the potential to promote some beneficial competition between the guys, knowing the people they're working has the ability to increase their bonus and trying to go the extra mile there.

I don't have much experience managing crews, but it seems like it could work.