Tree Weight

[GlennButler]

Has anyone made accurate measurements of above ground, total tree weights?

We can make reasonable estimates of course, but I would like to see some data. I would assume that after recording date and location, taking dsh, height, and crown measurements, we could load a single tree and weigh it at a local truck scale. Has anyone done this?

If this was done enough times with enough sizes and species, we might be able to generate some interesting graphs.

I'd like to see how well our theoretical calculations match up with actual data.

 

[tomthetreeman]

An experienced crane operator would be a good person to bring into the conversation.

I like to think my estimates are close, but I'd love to have a 'tree weight chart' similar to a 'green log chart.'

Obviously the log chart would be a good starting point:

http://www.sherrilltree.com/site/pdfs/Log_WeightChart.pdf

-Tom

 

[rfwoodvt]

I think the first place to start is with a wood volume formula. We've got a good first start with the loggers formulas but need to expand it to include branches on down to smaller parts.

I'd volunteer and even tho such a calc is on my list of things to do, it sits at the way bottom for stuff that is displaced but the "gotta-do" stuff.

I know there are lots of similar other calcs out there for foresters and what not.

I believe too that the urban forest strike team has some formulae for calculating volume of debris after a major weather event. I'll dig through my training material and see what I have.

 

[marlinspiker]

The Eastern Native Tree Society has an ample amount of data on tree volume measurement techniques. And of course you could start with the Green Weight Log Chart.

http://www.nativetreesociety.org/

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Taking taper into account is critical to having an accurate log weight.

Confirming calculations with a crane will make the rigger even better.

 

[climbncut]

I've always thought it would be cool to write down the weight of each pick while doing a crane removal and figure the total weight of the tree when the job is done. Also, I've wondered how much more a tree weighs when in full leaf and fruit compared to no leaves?

 

[GlennButler]

When the ideal job is scheduled, i.e. a single removal with time to make accurate measurements, an empty chip truck, empty log truck, I think I'll give this experiment a try. I'll post a picture of the tree and give you the specs, and we can see how close our estimates are to some actual data. Maybe I can come up with a small prize for the closest estimate.

It would certainly be interesting to have some seasonal data on similar trees.

 

[tomthetreeman]

Maybe we can have a thread entitled "Guess the weight" kind of like "Trees from a distance" LOL.

I'm IN!

-Tom

 

[Jamin_Mayer]

Sorry for the generic response...

Experience with crane work contributes a lot.

For example, a couple of weeks ago I had a 70' hybrid cottonwood to remove. I visualized the work to be done in 3 picks. One pick was 1,800lbs, the next 2,200lbs, and the last I quessed 4,500lbs.

If this thread has come up before that job, would have totaled the tre weight to be 8,500lbs. After, each pick, I was never off by about 250lbs(+ or -). 2 years ago I couldn't guess that close if my life depended on it.

But, I did use science to aid with learning weight of wood. I referenced a green log chart quite often.

 

[GlennButler]

What was the dsh and crown spread on the cottonwood? How high was the first limb? Was the tree pruned previously?

 

[Jamin_Mayer]

Crown width was only about 40'. DBH was 24". First limb was about 10' off the deck. There were about 8(ea) small diameter limbs (no smaller than 6" in diameter and no greater than 8" in diameter). The codomanant union was about 24' off the deck. No tree trimming in the past (other than minor de-limbing done by the owners).

 

[mdvaden]

Do most of you err on the high side? Like if a tree is hollow, do you calculate the weight as if its solid?

Anyone ever have to crane lift a trunk section with old concrete repair from days gone by, and had to guess weight?

 

[climbncut]

I hate concrete in trees...the saw always finds it before me

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Tim Walsh has developed a spread sheet with formulas built in where you insert:

species
diameter-top/middle/bottom
length

All of the calculations are built into the spreadsheet. A diamter tape and a smart phone or similar is all that's needed.

He's tested it on crane removals and found that the math works out VERY close to actual weight. Enough to be confident in it's accuracy when approaching weight limits of the crane.

Tim just sent me a proof of the article that will be in Tree Care Industry magazine. Don't even ask when it will be published...stay tuned!

 

[OasisTree]

This last fall I removed a 42" BDH Sycamore, est 85' tall. I was curious how much it weighed, so after the job I took both my log trailer and my chip truck across the scales. It showed that I had 10,000# of chips, and 10,000# of logs. It was in full leaf when I took it down.

 

[Chum]

I'll extropolate your Missouri sycamore records and apply that to landfill disposal rates here:

$480.00 for that tree. That would often be near half of the entire bid, depending on location and etcetera.

Not that different are your area hardwoods from our urban trees here. To consider I bring home every twig, leaf, and log...the past 20 years or so of removals I had to have saved well over a 1/4 of a million dollars in disposal fees.

Never had given that a moment's thought until now.

Now 'scuse me while I go back out, in this freezing rain, and monitor the bonfire that's been burning for the last five days.

 

[treedimensional]

So your contributing to global warming on 2 fronts!

Water here weights 10 lbs/gallon (Imperial) ice of course is slightly lighter. It would be awful diffucul to calculate the volume of ice on a tree.

 

[Chum]

Well, yeah...a little.

Most piles I leave to degredate and make soil, which is badly needed here. Last year I torched one and the critters that evacuated broke my heart.

To try and counter my larger-than-normal human addition to green-house gases I protest a few projects and make prosperity as hard as possible for Exxon-Mobile, Dow Chem, and Monsanto...at least as one man and his offspring can. Also I flip-off drivers of Hummer 2's and 3's and use no road courtesy towards Escalades or Expeditions being driven by stupid blonde trophy wives. I employ Pat Roberson's methods to pray and hope that individuals like Sarah Palin never make it out of Wasilla next time she boards a Gulfstream to bring her idiocy upon the rest of our nation or world, and I'm all for the ramming and sinking of every Japanese whaling vessel, crew on board or not.

I also plant purple cone flowers everywhere, hand-out acorns, and propagate citrus hybrids that seem resistant to freezing.

 

[tomthetreeman]

X2

...Talk about a thread derail!

-Tom

 

[Chum]

Sorry, had the television talking in the background - what News does to me.