Career advice?

TheCiscoKid

TheCiscoKid

Location
Brew City
To give you a background of my current company. We are located in S.E. Wisconsin with our boss, our foreman (who's been there for 16 years) me, and a young groundsman. We run a three man crew on every job. A couple of years ago, my boss decided to buy a nice 65ft biljax lift. We use it on pretty much every job and long as we can get access to the tree with it. Our foreman, is a an awesome guy, knows his stuff, and we really like working together. He is 99% of the time, the one in the lift. While I, and the other guy tend the ground.

He'll have me climb if there is a 2nd tree to do on the job while he's in the lift. This way we get more work out of our time. However, that's maybe once a week. Bottom line is, I feel too qualified to be working the ground and feel like I'm wasting my skills. I should mention, I have been climbing for 4 years. We are loaded with work, as we've been around for 30 years. My boss has flirted with the idea of running two crews-but I don't think he wants to put in double the work of scheduling, grinding stumps, purchasing additional equipment-things that could set me up running my own crew. He's talked about it a little, but nothing has happened. It just has me wondering if I will ever be able to advance up.

Not sure if anyone else is or has been in the same situation. Just looking for some feedback or advice. I don't want to come off sounding needy, or entitled-but I know my skills, I feel like I am holding myself back sometimes.
 
TheCiscoKid said:
To give you a background of my current company. We are located in S.E. Wisconsin with our boss, our foreman (who's been there for 16 years) me, and a young groundsman. We run a three man crew on every job. A couple of years ago, my boss decided to buy a nice 65ft biljax lift. We use it on pretty much every job and long as we can get access to the tree with it. Our foreman, is a an awesome guy, knows his stuff, and we really like working together. He is 99% of the time, the one in the lift. While I, and the other guy tend the ground.

He'll have me climb if there is a 2nd tree to do on the job while he's in the lift. This way we get more work out of our time. However, that's maybe once a week. Bottom line is, I feel too qualified to be working the ground and feel like I'm wasting my skills. I should mention, I have been climbing for 4 years. We are loaded with work, as we've been around for 30 years. My boss has flirted with the idea of running two crews-but I don't think he wants to put in double the work of scheduling, grinding stumps, purchasing additional equipment-things that could set me up running my own crew. He's talked about it a little, but nothing has happened. It just has me wondering if I will ever be able to advance up.

Not sure if anyone else is or has been in the same situation. Just looking for some feedback or advice. I don't want to come off sounding needy, or entitled-but I know my skills, I feel like I am holding myself back sometimes.
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Have you talked about entering a partnership with him? This way he runs a 2nd crew, doubles the company's income, but also has someone to split the behind the scenes workload with ; paperwork, invoicing, payroll, maintenance, etc.
 
CanadianStan said:
Have you talked about entering a partnership with him? This way he runs a 2nd crew, doubles the company's income, but also has someone to split the behind the scenes workload with ; paperwork, invoicing, payroll, maintenance, etc.
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Good thought!!
 
CanadianStan said:
Have you talked about entering a partnership with him? This way he runs a 2nd crew, doubles the company's income, but also has someone to split the behind the scenes workload with ; paperwork, invoicing, payroll, maintenance, etc.
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His wife does all invoicing and payroll. He gives us a overview at the job, drives around giving estimates all day, and grinds stumps. I know he wouldn't want to change office work procedures. He most likely would be worried about twice the amount of stumps, having to buy additional equipment (another truck, chipper, saws, etc) and trying to find storage for all of that. Right now our shop is a tight squeeze with a chip truck, chipper, wood truck and mini skid. I guess in the end it's mostly in his hands what he wants his business to be.

I'm trying to look at both ends of the spectrum. If I'm my boss, do I want to make such an investment when his business is lucrative as it is?
 
TheCiscoKid said:
His wife does all invoicing and payroll. He gives us a overview at the job, drives around giving estimates all day, and grinds stumps. I know he wouldn't want to change office work procedures. He most likely would be worried about twice the amount of stumps, having to buy additional equipment (another truck, chipper, saws, etc) and trying to find storage for all of that. Right now our shop is a tight squeeze with a chip truck, chipper, wood truck and mini skid. I guess in the end it's mostly in his hands what he wants his business to be.

I'm trying to look at both ends of the spectrum. If I'm my boss, do I want to make such an investment when his business is lucrative as it is?
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As a company with a similar model, I wouldn't invest in equipment for another crew because of one person unless I had worked with them for years and knew they were sticking around. You already laid out why I wouldn't when you said; "If I'm my boss, do I want to make such an investment when his business is lucrative as it is?' I would have to know you have what it takes to help make the 2nd crew work. However lucrative you think it is, you should probably cut that $$ in your head by 60-70%!

I would recommend having an honest conversation with him. You are clearly ambitious as the other poster said and it sounds like you are a valuable employee.

Does the owner even know you arent in the trees? Or is the foreman making that decision? Have you all set goals? Are you certified? Do you want to get various credentials? Are you interested in PHC? Why not a PHC department over another crew? It sounds like you know you want to climb more, so speak up. Figure out where you want to be in 6 months, 12 months, 24 months, discuss it with your boss and discuss how you will get there. I guarantee you that the answer will include climbing more and he should be willing to get you in the tree daily then. Happy employees are crucial and it sounds like you are a climber that simply wants to climb.

Not sure why a 2 climber crew only has one climber in the tree...that sounds like lost $$ to me.

Last thought...what was your title when hired? If they hired you as a climber, then mention that to. A "young groundsman" should be able to keep up on trims with you both when possible.

Good luck and hey - nice to hear someone aching to get in the trees.
 
I would have a good conversation with the owner. I am an owner of a company. I try my hardest to stay in-tuned with my employees and what their desires are, but....I will tell you. Most days my mind is elsewhere. As an owner you have a lot to think about. I wake up in the morning and have an inbox full of emails to respond to. Then throughout the day the phone calls get set to me via an email every three hours, I try and read them throughout the day and determine what needs to be taken care of immediately and what can wait until days end. Not to mention all the other issues that comes with running a business. There is a ton on my mind and I don't always pay attention to everyone feelings and weather or not their ambitious are being rightfully met.
Communication is key! Talk with him and see what his ideas are. Talk with him outside of work, over coffee or lunch. involve his wife if she is an active member of the company. Like some have said you are motivated and I would image your employer will value that.
I started a business and called it ArborClimb. Why? Because no one climbed around me. I am a very skilled climber and I market that. However, we bought a bucket truck, and use a crane from time to time and will buy one ourselves in a short time. I hardly every climb anymore. My guys hardly climb anymore. We can do almost all out jobs from the bucket truck or crane the tree out. It's just the market were in. I can get to almost every tree with equipment. Climbing is slower than using a bucket or crane on most of our trees because they are removals. I wish we could climb three days a week and use equipment for the other two. However, its just not feasible. I have to make so much money a day to keep the lights on. So, I understand your situation, but I see it from both sides.
 
ROYCE said:
I would have a good conversation with the owner. I am an owner of a company. I try my hardest to stay in-tuned with my employees and what their desires are, but....I will tell you. Most days my mind is elsewhere. As an owner you have a lot to think about. I wake up in the morning and have an inbox full of emails to respond to. Then throughout the day the phone calls get set to me via an email every three hours, I try and read them throughout the day and determine what needs to be taken care of immediately and what can wait until days end. Not to mention all the other issues that comes with running a business. There is a ton on my mind and I don't always pay attention to everyone feelings and weather or not their ambitious are being rightfully met.
Communication is key! Talk with him and see what his ideas are. Talk with him outside of work, over coffee or lunch. involve his wife if she is an active member of the company. Like some have said you are motivated and I would image your employer will value that.
I started a business and called it ArborClimb. Why? Because no one climbed around me. I am a very skilled climber and I market that. However, we bought a bucket truck, and use a crane from time to time and will buy one ourselves in a short time. I hardly every climb anymore. My guys hardly climb anymore. We can do almost all out jobs from the bucket truck or crane the tree out. It's just the market were in. I can get to almost every tree with equipment. Climbing is slower than using a bucket or crane on most of our trees because they are removals. I wish we could climb three days a week and use equipment for the other two. However, its just not feasible. I have to make so much money a day to keep the lights on. So, I understand your situation, but I see it from both sides.
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Insightful stuff-especially coming from a business owner. I'll give it a little more time, and talk to my boss about what the future holds.
 
What Royce is saying without saying it is he's got no time to be thinking for you. That is the case for every manager or owner. In all businesses the best approach with your supervisor is not to put the burden on them to think of your future or issues. They have problems they need to resolve so, be a solution. Think about what you're seeing and doing. How can you advance the business without over taxing the owner? Provide a proposal that covers all the concerns and do a cost benefit analysis for him to show what the upside would be.

When I was a groundsman I convinced my boss that I would be a better climber and increase the productivity. As a climber, I then explained how I could manage the crew and get the work done as per his specs without him having to even show up except to leave us the work orders for the day. This allowed the business to grow and for him to focus on the business instead of the day to day stuff.

When you're on the job talk to the foreman about getting more air time. Again, the key is how will having you up in a tree improve the overall productivity.
 
treehumper said:
What Royce is saying without saying it is he's got no time to be thinking for you. That is the case for every manager or owner. In all businesses the best approach with your supervisor is not to put the burden on them to think of your future or issues. They have problems they need to resolve so, be a solution. Think about what you're seeing and doing. How can you advance the business without over taxing the owner? Provide a proposal that covers all the concerns and do a cost benefit analysis for him to show what the upside would be.

When I was a groundsman I convinced my boss that I would be a better climber and increase the productivity. As a climber, I then explained how I could manage the crew and get the work done as per his specs without him having to even show up except to leave us the work orders for the day. This allowed the business to grow and for him to focus on the business instead of the day to day stuff.

When you're on the job talk to the foreman about getting more air time. Again, the key is how will having you up in a tree improve the overall productivity.
Click to expand...

Great stuff. My boss is very rarely on the jobsite, so he doesn't know my concerns. I think what I'm going to do is have a talk with him-see where he even wants his business to be, and how I can be a bigger role in the trees and among the crew. If he likes where things are at, then maybe I'll need to explore other options. Thanks for all the advice. I'll update sometime next week.
 
@TheCiscoKid
I started at a landscape company working for a guy with a arboriculture background who wanted to get back into tree biz. I was green, knew almost nothing, and we had random tree jobs from time to time. Never enough to get good experience, and I hate landscaping.
I left, went to a production tree work company for a while, learn lots and beefed up my confidence. Now I'm back that I guy started with who Im kinda close with, much more qualified which allows him to take on any kind of tree work, which encouraged him to invest in equipment with confidence.

If he doesn't feel confident giving you the reigns with a crew and taking advantage of what you can do and how much you want to improve your skills, maybe leave, if just for a little while.

Good luck bub
 
ROYCE said:
I would have a good conversation with the owner. I am an owner of a company. I try my hardest to stay in-tuned with my employees and what their desires are, but....I will tell you. Most days my mind is elsewhere. As an owner you have a lot to think about. I wake up in the morning and have an inbox full of emails to respond to. Then throughout the day the phone calls get set to me via an email every three hours, I try and read them throughout the day and determine what needs to be taken care of immediately and what can wait until days end. Not to mention all the other issues that comes with running a business. There is a ton on my mind and I don't always pay attention to everyone feelings and weather or not their ambitious are being rightfully met.
Communication is key! Talk with him and see what his ideas are. Talk with him outside of work, over coffee or lunch. involve his wife if she is an active member of the company. Like some have said you are motivated and I would image your employer will value that.
I started a business and called it ArborClimb. Why? Because no one climbed around me. I am a very skilled climber and I market that. However, we bought a bucket truck, and use a crane from time to time and will buy one ourselves in a short time. I hardly every climb anymore. My guys hardly climb anymore. We can do almost all out jobs from the bucket truck or crane the tree out. It's just the market were in. I can get to almost every tree with equipment. Climbing is slower than using a bucket or crane on most of our trees because they are removals. I wish we could climb three days a week and use equipment for the other two. However, its just not feasible. I have to make so much money a day to keep the lights on. So, I understand your situation, but I see it from both sides.
Click to expand...

Hey Royce, how do you get voice mails sent to your email inbox?
 
Gorman said:
Hey Royce, how do you get voice mails sent to your email inbox?
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I pay 99 dollars a month for an answering service. Its a live person that answers phone calls from 6am-9pm. Then it goes to an automated voice messaging system. They email me whatever the message is.
So, if a customer calls between the hours of 6am and 9pm then someone answers the phone at the call center. They take the message and then every few hours they send them to me via email with whatever calls have come through. It's set up to whatever way I want. Meaning.
They take name, number, time of call, town they live in and address, they also take their email address and whatever the message was. So, I will get an email with something like the following

Joan Pack
114 Main street
Charlestown NH 03544
603-876-8997
Joan.pack@gmail.com
Looking for an estimate to remove three pine trees in back yard. Best to reach her in the evenings after 5pm.

So I either call or email them back and then copy and paste that into my google calendar. You can also set up how often you want emails sent. I have it done a few times a day. First thing in the morning, then around 10am, 12 noon, 2pm then at 4pm and again at 6pm. Then anything after 6 I will receive the next morning.
 
Wow. @ROYCE, that is a really slick and powerful service to have for what seems to me to be an incredibly reasonable price! It seems like acquiring just one customer per month as a result of getting back to them quickly because of this service you have would more than pay for the cost of the service each month. Nice find!

Is it ok to give this service a mention, or would that be bad manners, as far as forum use is concerned?

Thanks in advance.

Tim
 
TimBr said:
Wow. @ROYCE, that is a really slick and powerful service to have for what seems to me to be an incredibly reasonable price! It seems like acquiring just one customer per month as a result of getting back to them quickly because of this service you have would more than pay for the cost of the service each month. Nice find!

Is it ok to give this service a mention, or would that be bad manners, as far as forum use is concerned?

Thanks in advance.

Tim
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Yeah it is a really nice service to have. Also, you can get live coverage on a short notice for 24 hours if need be. Or, if a storm tools through you can have 24 hour coverage in order to get all the calls responded to.

I would mention it, but not sure about forum rules on that. I am also not sure it it;s only related to my area. If anyone is interested PM me and I can pass along the information. Most call centers are doing it this way now.
 
My phone company offers something like this, but without the answering service. I login to my account and I have a list of settings. So I can get a audio file emailed to me of the voicemail, along with times, and phone numbers.

It's not nearly as fancy and there is no live person, but it is just the cost of the voicemail service (about 5$ per mo)
 
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