Free fall with Rope Runner Pro

[ghostice]

Was finishing up a really really pitchy spruce wreck out yesterday and was comin' down to fell the spar to finish up. Was a great day. Rope and everything else was pitchy/ sappy but only here and there - the tree was loaded with cones dripping sap after prolonged spell of rains last month or two. Anyway musta hit a sappy rope stretch and when I gave a bit more force on the bird section on the RRP (no neck tether attached), literally went into a free fall for about three or four feet, right to the deck. Scared the crap outta me not to mention the HO. Looking at the rope today, it's actually not that pitchy really and didn't see any huge build up on the RRP either (actually none on the straight cam thingy). As I've said before, I usually come down with a munter on my right leg as a back up but didn't this time as I was on spurs, smaller tree, end of day, etc. My own lesson learned is that I'd now only descend on RRP with any sap around , even on spurs, with steel core lanyard still on the tree. Now I don't trust the thing fully (esp given the problem I've had with the bollard screws stripping/ new one, yadda yadda). Higher up this wouldn't have been a party at all. Any thoughts anyone? My ropes are cleaned, sap removed with ethyl alcohol and washed with rope wash reasonably often. This was plain weird. RRP is now sitting on my desk, it staring at me and I staring back . . . .

 

[Bart_]

I have a possibly analogous situation on my milling machine quill, might explain it. When you buy a machine it's covered in waxy grease to prevent rust. Looks like thin toffee. You break out the solvent and remove it all. Solvent changes it back towards application viscosity prior to it drying like paint. Point being its hard to get all of it off/out of every crevice. So what happens on my mill randomly is a tiny bit of the waxy stuff breaks free or emerges or sags or something randomly and really gums up the quill travel. In the past I have disassembled and re-cleaned to fix, but it still recurs. I've never been able to find the offending goop. It feels like the quill is moving in a bucket of tar. Then it will break free and travel smooth as a kitten. So there's a good chance on a super pitchy day/tree a small bit of stickiness got into just the right spot to inhibit the free motion of, I'd guess, the bird pivot as that's to my mind the most sensitive part of the mechanism. The stickiness only lasted about a second or 3' fall and then the goop particle smooshed, fell out or whatever and you couldn't find the "cause". Best analysis I can come up with. If right there could be a lesson in there.

 

[ghostice]

Can't find any difference in the bird "springiness" before or now after my wake up call. It still hops up at about the same rate. Keep it dry lubed (good old teflon spray lube is another thing banned in Cant-ada now). Rope was older (cuz of the sap fest) Cherry Bomb (I not II) which've used for years from the RR I days. So not sure what was up this time. Had used this rig in a spruce the week before, no problemo like normal. Appreciate any ideas.

 

[96coal449]

I'm in agreeance with a small ball of sap sticking the mechanism for free fall. Falling out afterwards for staging a mystery as to what went wrong. Happens to my ZZ in that sticky sap. Just enough to make it jumpy and slip some rope a bit.

Ghostice, I realize you're no novice. It's just the best answer I can come up with.

God I hate pine sap.

To all, anyone have a backup safe net? Kind of like the practice of using 2 life lines on the other side of the pond?

 

[misfit]

I certainly don't know the answer to your question, and I understand why you are blaming the RRP, but I would be more inclined to blame the non-uniformity of the admittedly-old rope. I wonder if you can find that same section of rope and experiment with it in a safe manner to see if you can replicate the problem. I suspect any all-mechanical device would behave the same way on that stretch of rope, and if they do, then it's the rope, not the RRP, and maybe you and the RRP won't have to stare at each other suspiciously any longer. I really want to like all the all-mechanical devices we have today, but I always go back to the hitch and Rope Wrench because hitch cord is so flexible and adapts better and faster to changes in the uniformity of the rope, and also because the Rope Wrench sets a limit on how fast I can fall in the highly unlikely even that my hitch completely fails in some way. When an all-mechanical device fails, even for a short time, the result is almost total free-fall as you experienced.

For a backup device, I have no experience, but a climber friend of mine uses the Petzl ASAP and he says it works great. He says it just follows you along nicely without intervention, but if you take a sudden drop, it engages.

 

[DSMc]

... As I've said before, I usually come down with a munter on my right leg as a back...

Why? I can't imagine using any tree climbing ascending/descending device that I trusted so little as to feel the 'need' for a backup. They must work one hundred percent of the time, without question.

 

[ghostice]

Habit I guess from alpine. We've always gone with ATC & shunt or ATC and munter on lower D or leg loop. The munter in winter strips ice/ snow/ glop from the rope (at times your waist or leg will be white). Lots of folks just used a ring and biner too (an old Teufelberger video - Hitchclimbers Guide to the Canopy I think it was). Years ago I did use the munter and then a hitch (in tree) - munter takes some of the friction from the hitch I guess. Now we have rope wrench etc.
Rope is a bit gooey here n there but not a diameter change that I can feel (when I say old rope it's just been filed away for some while not thrashed daily). I can say it's probably not the rope.
Appreciate the comments - this was my wake up call. Gravity can be so wicked.
Cheers

Addenda: Interms of "newer" ropes I do like the RRP on Squir.

 

[Bart_]

RW without the tension on the rope below it won't generate any appreciable drag force. The harder the hitch loads the rope the more drag the RW makes.

So my can of teflon spray lube is unreplaceable? Another go to is Tri-flo.

 

[ghostice]

So my can of teflon spray lube is unreplaceable? Another go to is Tri-flo.

Seems we're headed that way - no more teflon lube spray, no more snowblower anti clog spray, hard to get lacquer auto spray paint , no more fertiilizers we used to get, but the Montreal condo dwellers that now rule Cant- ada with an iron (French) fist know whats best if we are to become pure of soul!
What next ?

 

[Steve Connally]

I don't have anything to add other than. Glad you're ok!!!

 

[oldoakman]

I have had almost the same experience except without the pitch with my RRP. It has gotten to the point that I am seriously thinking about selling it. I retrieved my OG runner with the baby bump from my northern gear stash and like it so much better other than putting it on and off the rope. My sudden releases have not been as dramatic as yours though.

 

[Serf Life]

good old teflon spray lube is another thing banned in Cant-ada now

For a valid reason to be fair. Thanks to decades of pfas use there are whole areas in my state one can't eat deer, and dairy businesses gone. I appreciate being peeved when "the good 'ol" products are taken off shelves (enter worthless PT lumber) but it's because they shouldn't have been on the market to begin with (enter ddt, leaded gas, lead paint).