Clove Hitch

Crimsonking

Carpal tunnel level member
It’s my go-to when rigging stems without forks or other features that will hold a running bowline.
 

Dan Cobb

Branched out member
Location
Hoover
I like the clove hitch-half hitch-clove hitch arrangement for attaching throwline to rope.

Also, I have the impression that you thoughtfully laid out the setup for the video, but your kitchen seems too acoustically "live" for the best audio.
 
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Flying~Squirrel

New member
Location
Tacoma
My motto when using a clove hitch: "there's probably a better knot." It's hard to untie when you want it to and comes untied when you don't. I used it a lot when working at a ski area for setting up rope lines on bamboo, but hardly ever for tree work.
 

Crimsonking

Carpal tunnel level member
Mid line clove hitch is nice for sending up water bottles and poles.



Is it hard to untie after heavy pieces?
I’ve never seen one jam like a butterfly. I’ve tied 1k lb logs and it still unties. They become impossible after repeated loading, like if you used one to tie a block to a stem.

My motto when using a clove hitch: "there's probably a better knot." It's hard to untie when you want it to and comes untied when you don't. I used it a lot when working at a ski area for setting up rope lines on bamboo, but hardly ever for tree work.
It’s a wonderful knot with many uses, when tied and applied properly. When tying a clove with the tail of a line you MUST lock it off with two half hitches.

I hear people swear off knots, and it saddens me, because it limits potential. The clove hitch and anchor hitch scare people, but they’re amazing, versatile options to know and use. Tie, dress, set. Lock off appropriately. Right knot, right place.
 

Flying~Squirrel

New member
Location
Tacoma
I’ve never seen one jam like a butterfly. I’ve tied 1k lb logs and it still unties. They become impossible after repeated loading, like if you used one to tie a block to a stem.


It’s a wonderful knot with many uses, when tied and applied properly. When tying a clove with the tail of a line you MUST lock it off with two half hitches.

I hear people swear off knots, and it saddens me, because it limits potential. The clove hitch and anchor hitch scare people, but they’re amazing, versatile options to know and use. Tie, dress, set. Lock off appropriately. Right knot, right place.
I'll agree about not swearing things off. I wouldn't say I've sworn it off completely, even if I made it sound like that in my last post, but I stand by the idea that for every common use for clove hitches in tree work, there is another knot I prefer. For rigging down wood, I use a running bowline with a half hitch - fast to tie and never jams. For crane spider legs, I use a cow hitch - easy to adjust slack, easy to untie. For tying equipment onto a climbing line, I use a slipknot and a biner - gotta hang it on something anyways. A clove hitch works, but other knots work too and have significant benefits that the clove hitch lacks.
 
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Crimsonking

Carpal tunnel level member
Tastes, right? I am much quicker at tying the clove than the bowline and half hitch. I find it less hassle too. I’m curious about people having trouble untying the clove in rigging scenarios. It has never cinched too tight when I’ve used it.
 

Mowerr

Branched out member
Location
Ny
Ya that's one if the nice things about the clove is when you get used to it, you can tie it really fast even one handed, just back it up with the half hitches.
 

agent_smith

New member
Location
Townsville
Hello Kevin? (you didn't introduce yourself in the video...)
Thanks for producing and sharing your video it is appreciated.
Just giving you some feedback in good faith...

at 0:15 A Clove hitch is 'TIB' (Tiable In the Bight). The definition of TIB is that the knot structure can be tied without access to either end - and the opposite is also true - in that the knot structure can be untied without access to either end (and no remnant knot is left in the line). Knots that are 'TIB' are more efficient.

at 0:26 They are not "counter-clockwise turns". You actually formed 2 loop with 'Z' chirality.
You should also state that a Clove hitch can be formed from 2 loops with 'S' chirality. Tie any knot and hold it adjacent to a plane mirror. The reflection you see will be the inverse - and it is equally valid.
The geometric structure of a Clove hitch is that it consists of 2 loops of the same chirality (either S/S or Z/Z). You obviously have a natural tendency to tie your Clove hitch in Z/Z chirality. Furthermore, the key component is the riding turn - which is angled diagonally right in Z/Z geometry and angled diagonally left in S/S geometry. The riding turn (or riding segment) is what powers the Clove hitch.

at 18:02 Your 'Mooring hitch' is 'slipped' - ie, it has a quick release toggle. Knot geeks refer to this as 'slipping' the knot structure.

General comments:
1. A Clove hitch is a type of hitch classified as a 'binder'. Another example of a binder hitch is the Constrictor.
2. You should mention that binder hitches work best on a round profile (they are not so good on a square profile).
3. Binder hitches progressively crush their host - so heavy loads can cause jamming.
4. There is a distinction to be made between a 'loop' and a 'turn'. A 'turn' goes around a separate object (think round turn and 2 half hitches...the initial round turn goes around the object - eg a post). Turns are defined in terms of number of degrees that they arc - eg a U turn is 180 degrees, and a round turn is 540 degrees.
5. Loops always have a particular chirality (either S or Z) and don't require a host to form around - ie you can form a loop in your hand.
...

Hitches can be classified as:
[ ] Binders (eg Clove hitch, Constrictor, Gleipnir, etc)
[ ] Nooses (eg Gnat noose, #409 double overhand noose, etc)
[ ] Slide and grip (eg #1763 Prusik hitch, Klemheist, Schwabisch, Distel, etc etc )
[ ] Load control (eg #206 Crossing hitch - aka Munter hitch, and Mariner)

...

Keep up the good work :)
 

Reach

Been here a while
Location
Atglen, PA
Tastes, right? I am much quicker at tying the clove than the bowline and half hitch. I find it less hassle too. I’m curious about people having trouble untying the clove in rigging scenarios. It has never cinched too tight when I’ve used it.
I too like the clove, I frequently use it on spider legs lifting with a crane; I usually use it on horizontal limbs and prefer a running bowline on vertical limbs. I’ve never had a problem with it either, and have tied it probably thousands of times over the years.
 

Chaplain242

Branched out member
I don’t use clove hitches any more since I shock loaded one once and it literally exploded to a clean line mid air and dropped the load - I will note that the shock load was somewhat in the direction of the axis of the knot - however it was unsettling to see it happen in real time... A round turn is more stable...
 

TheTreeSpyder

Participating member
Location
Florida>>> USA
Very nice contribution; anything i add is meant to help, give different facet view angle to same gem; and so sorry, also delves into questionable realm of own personal, twisted brain works and internal namings etc...​

i say the initial naming is by:
Termination is a Hitch,
Bend is a coupling,
Knot is a Stand Alone OR Binder.
BUT note, that a Constrictor or Ground Line or (fave)Bag can be used to terminate force flow or bind, depending on if initial force from host swell inside the controlling arcs (Round Binding) or force input external from Standing Part loaded (Hitch). So, naming is a convention, but same knot can change force patterns depending on usage if Round Binding against initiating force of round swell as system input, or if same form used as Hitch . In use, most lacings are linear force imposed against and into the controlling arcs. Only Round Binding with radial force input into controlling arcs is of different rule set.
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Clove Hitch alone with side crossing as continuous turns example offers efficiency/strength more determined by host mount size for primary deformity of greatest force ; but Cow/Backhand Turn types deform support of Standing Part more harshly and before host.
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i think 1x180 arc gives hook pull, another 180adds 1dimnsional grip, 3rd 180 can give 2D grip, more 180s expand on 2D framework
i consider a Round Turn an uncrossed, continuous direction representation of 3x180 .
and then a Clove (w/o final tuck) a Crossed Turn base continuous direction 3x180
and then 04:45 shows (before final Half) a Backhand Turn of reverse/counter torque direction that becomes Cow with tuck in pull 1 leg, Girth Hitch if pull both legs, choker if round sling that pulls both legs too but self adjusts so that both legs pulled evenly.
By and large, the reverse Backhand Turn style is easier untie as doesn't walk as continuous turn mechanics do. So not as tight, but walk of continuous turns might even walk off the job.. The amount of friction and strength/efficiency in Clove depends on if crossing is 90 degrees from input force, opposing side from input or in normal 90 degree from input
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i always say 2 Half Hitches finish, Clove is nice mnemonic, but perhaps less proper functional representation.
If following single turn, i look at 2nd Half Hitch to stop 1st from PULLING OUT.
But, following Round Turn/Crossed Turn/Backhand Turn so little force to Half Hitch to trap self, i follow the form and think in terms of 2nd Half so 1st doesn't FALL OUT. Especially
And maintain the 2is1, 1isNone mantra. Saying Clove after Clove is fair mnemonic but will find we generally describe as 2 half Hitches or in Cow type finish Opposing Half Hitches. Easier untie for opposing Halfs, even as 'innies' Clove type finish in Buntline mucho harder untie than Cow type opposing, counter torque finish of Lobster Buoy.
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05:50 would make point (that actually show)of trapping under the extension from Standing Part for most trap pressure, OVER first as shown, not short way home of immediate tuck w/o crossing. Over before tuck is more like ABoK#1666 fig8 gives more frictions, and spaces to better tuck position/pressure away from input.
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"Over kill for under kill is good"
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Timber Hitch#1665 to me is extension of Half Hitch#1662, as also follows order in right angle hitch chapter_22 that starts with #1662 Half Hitch. The long way home fig8#1666 type base for Timber fig.8#1668 is best here too, books say at least 3 tucks for normal Timber and 2 for fig8 style, but that was in Natural fiber... For me it the real working tuck is the last tuck and try to place as close to opposite on host of the initiating pull on Standing Part, previous tucks i use as mostly spacers to that position and force reduction. Thus 'expresses' easier, more powerfully on small host. Large host i use more spacers//tucks to put final tuck more 180 from Standing Part. This is is not a 2D grip even if tuck all the way around.
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12:00 i have done double tuck as shown for secured and cleaner Anchor Hitch, but prefer 3 ring Scaffold Hitch, can slip off open end of carabiner okay and Anchor shears across Standing Part, but the Scaffold pulls more properly ALONG Standing Part more efficently strengthwise.
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These are all right angle pulls chapter_21 would prefer pre-fixxing Half Hitch for lengthwise pulls chapter_22. Logically linear parts majorly run perpendicular to or along side host, especially the initial contact.
Half Hitch comes in Termination and Coupling flavors too!
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21:00 Friction Hitch hitching is weaker and pulls hitch more open if seat close to host, especially large host; as pull away from host is stronger, but reciprocally lessens grip on host.
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All knots best on round host to me. Linear faced host not same frictions, nips etc. Linear vs. Radial always matter, and here matters more as formation 'hosted' than round vs. flat(webbing)rope device served around host.
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Sorry so long but just love this chit, and try to lend some of decades of thoughts and digestions.
 
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Tastes, right? I am much quicker at tying the clove than the bowline and half hitch. I find it less hassle too. I’m curious about people having trouble untying the clove in rigging scenarios. It has never cinched too tight when I’ve used it.
The few times the climber at the company i work for has used the clove, its cinched so tightly we had to spend a good 5 minutes trying to break it loose. Running Bowline and Siberian Hitch are leagues better for rigging imo. If i have to spend real time trying to untie something then it isnt worth it
 

southsoundtree

Been here a while
Location
Olympia, WA
I like the clove hitch-half hitch-clove hitch arrangement for attaching throwline to rope.

Also, I have the impression that you thoughtfully laid out the setup for the video, but your kitchen seems too acoustically "live" for the best audio.
I use a clove at the start, and half- hitches to the end, to prevent binding.
 

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