Safe PHC Programs Low-NO Toxicity

#1
What low to no toxicity products are out there that we can effectively be using fairly "safe" for the applicator and low risk for potential environmental detriment. It would be great to make a list and share our experiences.

I'll Start"

hort & neem oils foliar spray - HWA, scale, spider mites, powdery mildew, etc,etc???

BT Bacteria foliar spray - defoliators including gypsy moths, bagworms, etc, etc??? I am very interested in learning more about BT potential!

Lepitect soil application - Aphids, bagworms, cankerworms, gall forming insects, gypsy moth, Japanese beetles, lacebugs, leaf beetles, leafhoppers, leafminers, leafrollers, lepidopteran larvae, maple shoot moth, oakworm, pinecone worm, spider moth, tent caterpillar, tiger moth, webworm

Safari soil/trunk: applicationhttp://www.valenttrainingmodules.com/safari/index.cfm?page=1
http://www.valent.com/professional/products/safari/video.cfm

Merit soil application: HWA, EAB, etc etc

nutrol+prudent 44: fungal issues:
Nhttp://www.lidochem.com/flyers/Nutrol_T&O_PIB.pdfutrol+prudebt 44 - Fungal root rot, anthractnose
http://www.lidochem.com/flyers/Prudent44_AS_T&O_PIB.pdf
 
#2
We use hort oil and BT lots. Not sure what some of the others are, maybe use the active ingredient instead of the trade name.

I find that there are tons of pests that we don't need to treat for. maybe i'm losing money by showing up to a house and telling the HO that the damage is inconsequential and doesn't need treatment. Probably tossing away an easy $100 but i think that pesticides should be a last resort in all cases.

That said: look into TreeAzin (a neem oil product). There's no way that Merit (or any imidacloprid formulation) is low toxicity.

Bugs have to eat too right? They don't all have to be killed.

Looks like safari is far from low toxicity with a such a broad spectrum of control and a soil half life of 22-68 days.

There are really only a few pests that you listed that actually kill trees.
 
#3
Actually Merit and Safari are pretty friendly considering they do not harm pests unless theyre feeding on the target plant. Much better than say a blanket spray of Byfenthrin which kills nearly everything.
 
#4
Nothin special, would you mind explaining what all you use BT for and how you apply it etc etc? Much appreciated!

As for the imidacloprid, dinotefuran & acephate being toxic, it certainly should be used wisely and only as needed to keep trees alive. I only use these products on pests that will otherwise kill the tree, like HWA, EAB and SEVERE outbreaks of bagworms, spidermites, scale etc. These products are generally safe to the applicator (humans) and supposedly water contamination and leaching is not an issue when used properly. I think if farmers are crop dusting the stuff and lawn services are mass broadcasting it, it would certainly be a bigger issue compared to minimal kiroitz injections or basal drenches far away from a water source.

I'll check out TreeAzin, certainly is appealing to think there is an "eco-friendly" way to treat EAB.

Tree junkie, thats exactly why I posted this thread was to learn of alternatives to blanket sprays of bifenthrin and other such chemicals. That is certainly my least favorite part of PHC.

Sorry couple of my links don't work
 
#5
We haven't used lepitect as of yet however we occasional use the dendrex micro injectors for things like web worm, bagworm, etc. where merit, dino are not effective....I personally am not a big believer in the lepitect claim of effectiveness on spider mites....they're a tricky pest and i'm not a believer that one product will take care of them...we rotate hort, hexygon, and Avid...

My thoughts on the TreeAzin is it sounds like another tool to use in the right situation. Do i think its gonna be the greatest thing for control of EAB....NO! I've heard too many stories already of pests becoming quickly resistant to Neem. However in situations where you find severe insect/disease pressure often even our strongest chems are not 100% effective...maybe in a situation where i'm dealing with a low pressure, low risk, low value tree then maybe .....But when we get into high value trees i wouldn't put my name behind a product unless I felt it was the most effective product available.
 
#6
Bt (var Kurstaki) works on all lepidopterans (moths and butterflies) but not sawfly larvae. We use it for tent caterpillar, apple thorn skeletonizer, cankerworms, gypsy moth, spruce and pine budworms etc. The key is that they have to consume it for it to work so it has to be sprayed early instar when the critters are feeding. Rain won't be a good thing within 24 hrs or so of spraying.

I am in canada and we are severely limited by what we can apply. The only tree injections we can legally use are ace caps (acephate) and treeazin for ash only. It's a bit BS but i do feel that there are far too many pesticides used south of the border. It's lower impact environmentally to inject into trees or soil around the trees but there will be collateral damage.

Look at pyrthrins (sp?) as a natural spray. They're made from chrysanthemums and are considered environmentally friendly although they're still toxic to people and especially cats. Who needs cats anyway?

We should be caring for trees with proper soil treatments and good pruning, not pesticides (that's the fundamental of PHC right?)

Am i ranting now? At a trade show i asked several pesticide vendors if they have registration in canada and several shook their heads in frustration about our tight rules. I was actually offended and wanted to tell them that the US has a far too lax registration system. I think this is very very true.

Maybe i'm just lazy with PHC, it's a very tough and complicated business to run. We save all kinds of trees through simple good pruning, education, soil treatments and more education.

keep it really real yo
 
#7
Anothere Product we've had good luck with: Agri-Fos as a trunk spray mixed with Pentra-Bark. It's labeled for scab and as i remember its also labeled for certain strains of pithium.. I've been hearing good luck from a couple of other applicators getting good results on sycamore antracnose and even DED suppression..... Pretty sure it's pretty enviro friendly as I believe it's just super high dosage of Phosphorus or similar.
 
#10
When I think "safe" or "low toxicity", I think about humans, but I also take a bigger consideration to bees, worms, bacteria, fungi, nematodes, and the rest of the "herd". What do the chemicals above do to these? Imidacloprid is banned in UK, Germany, France, etc because of the thought that it leads to honey bee death, and kills earthworms and other beneficials in the soil.

How about Phosphorus?! banned in too many places to list. In PA you cant buy laundry detergent containing over a certain % of this chemical. FL is moving to ban it altogether, as are many other states.

When you think "safe", think in a broader way then just human impact. Kill off the bees and worms and see what we are left with for food and quality of life.
 
#11
DutchTrig is preventative. Cheaper and faster to apply than (alamo is it?) the other 3 year protectant. Keeps cash flowing more regularly too. Treatment for DED trees here is the chainsaw, although i haven't seen it in the area for several years.
 
#12
Bull, I share your concerns. But how are we to keep hemlock trees alive without the use of these systemic insecticides where oil sprays are out of the question?

What is more environmentally detrimental, applying imidacloprid or dinotefuran around the base of a tree or allowing thousands of hemlocks to die that hold soil, shade water, cool climates, create habitat etc?

I'm not being a smart @$$, I struggle with this question.
 
#13
Another question I have is how much of the possible colony collapse of bees could be attribited to arboriculture, especially when only treating non flowering large trees applied as a soil drench or kioritz very close to the trunk VS the use of these chemicals broadcasted over a farm field, over thousands of lawns and used as foliar sprays on flowering plants?
 
#14
[ QUOTE ]
Bull, I share your concerns. But how are we to keep hemlock trees alive without the use of these systemic insecticides where oil sprays are out of the question?

What is more environmentally detrimental, applying imidacloprid or dinotefuran around the base of a tree or allowing thousands of hemlocks to die that hold soil, shade water, cool climates, create habitat etc?

I'm not being a smart @$$, I struggle with this question.

[/ QUOTE ]
I agree, its lesser of two evils unfortunately. Trunk injections are getting better as well for an alternative of soil drench.
 
#15
[ QUOTE ]
Another question I have is how much of the possible colony collapse of bees could be attribited to arboriculture, especially when only treating non flowering large trees applied as a soil drench or kioritz very close to the trunk VS the use of these chemicals broadcasted over a farm field, over thousands of lawns and used as foliar sprays on flowering plants?

[/ QUOTE ]

Does it matter if its attributed 10% to Arbo or 90% to Arbo?
 
#16
[/ QUOTE ]
Does it matter if its attributed 10% to Arbo or 90% to Arbo?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes it matters. It's called an acceptable tolerance....Risk versus reward...
Some people can find something wrong with anything, chemicals seem to be one of their favorite things to criticize...
My personal opinion is the reward of use out weighs the risk in our industry and therefor I apply when necessarry.
 
#17
[ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]
Does it matter if its attributed 10% to Arbo or 90% to Arbo?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes it matters. It's called an acceptable tolerance....Risk versus reward...
Some people can find something wrong with anything, chemicals seem to be one of their favorite things to criticize...
My personal opinion is the reward of use out weighs the risk in our industry and therefor I apply when necessarry.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree. I think chemical shave their place and time, but not when certain animals, especially bees which are vital to our very existance, may be harmed. There are alternative application times, and most times alternative chemicals to be used.
 
#18
I think that arboriculture puts a miniscule amount of pesticides into the environment when compared to agriculture and to a lesser degree lawn care. The amount of imidacloprid us arborists would use is small even compared to grub treatments for lawns (don't get me started on how stupid lawns are, but then i'm likely preaching to the converted).

There are so few pests that require control in order to save the tree. Most cases just moderate control is enough to sustain good tree growth. Use harder pesticides only if tree death is imminent.

So then, do we apply pesticides to ash trees every year or two or three for ever and ever? Do we cut them down and plant something else? What's the environmentaly right thing to do there? I dunno.
 
#20
Most guys start off in gtc then move into phc. I ask guys who are concerned about pesticide safety, how many times while climbing were you told you are crazy hanging off a rope 50ft or 100ft up in a canopy? To the untrained eye it looks crazy. But the trained professional is perfectly safe, provided that he does not do anything stupid, and is using proper equipment for the task at hand.
Chemical use is exactly the same. If used properly, with proper ppe, according to label specifics, it is safe for the trained professionals to use. I can't remember ever seeing a write up in the back of TCIA about a phc guy getting killed.
As a side note, risk to pollenators is eliminated if neo nics are not used on flowering plants that are pollinated by insects. Make it your company policy that no flowering plants will be treated with neo nics and you've taken that risk off the table.
 
Top