PPE and Safety

Discussion in 'Climber's Talk' started by Mel, Oct 26, 2017.

Tags:
  1. theatertech87

    theatertech87 Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2015
    Messages:
    88
    Location:
    Rochester
    Hard hat with muffs (ear plugs too if I'm doing a lot of chipping)
    Safety glasses tinted our mesh based on brightness
    Hi vis vest and or reflective vest
    Chaps (saw pants if I'm going to be cutting a lot on the ground)
    Chainsaw boots with steel toes (cause they are incredibly comfortable)

    I absolutely despise gloves, and only put them in for the instant I need to rope something, then they get put down again.
    Cut myself with a saw right when I started tree work and chaps have become an always things since then (didn't know better at the time)
    Hard hat and glasses I've worn as long as I can remember and have saved me from painful injury before (stuff coming back out of the chipper and dislodged hangers)
     
    Mel likes this.
  2. macswan

    macswan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    3,219
    Location:
    Champlain Valley, VT
    Helmet

    Glasses

    Often hi viz

    Often saw pants, if not, chaps when cutting on ground

    Gloves for climbing mostly, gloves for nasty stuff on ground

    Always wear boots, often chainsaw boots
     
  3. colb

    colb Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2014
    Messages:
    912
    Location:
    Florida
    Accident *prevention* is key. All workers know primary causes of mortality in the industry. Slow saw training (usually about a month before use) for newbs, and regular conversations about saw safety thereafter, so I can learn too. No one else climbs unless they ask three times and have the right disposition. No chipper.

    Pfanner protos' helmets with mesh visor (too humid for glasses here) and SENA comm.

    Stein hi viz shirts, whole crew.

    Orange chaps for ground crew, pfanner gladiator protective pants for me.

    No gloves, anywhere, but have them on hand. ...

    Steel toe, non-chainsaw-protective leather lineman boots for me. The best footwear I can coax out of my ground crew.

    Tree work ahead/drop zone signs deployed at all approaches. I also use yellow caution tape barriers when dropping into the road.
     
    Mel and Tyler Durden like this.
  4. robinia

    robinia Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,254
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Total opposite! haha.
    I never use gloves anymore but always did DdRT.
     
    TCtreeswinger likes this.
  5. treehumper

    treehumper Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2006
    Messages:
    6,453
    Location:
    Ridgefield, NJ
    Note he didn't say thong.., those under chaps would be gay.
     
    JD3000 likes this.
  6. JD3000

    JD3000 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Messages:
    4,997
    Location:
    Columbus
    Pretty sure I've derailed enough here today...
     
    TimBr and treehumper like this.
  7. treehumper

    treehumper Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2006
    Messages:
    6,453
    Location:
    Ridgefield, NJ
    but for the record....
    Kask helmet with visor and ear protection, sena comms built in.
    Safety glasses. I wear glasses as it is so these are specifically for work.
    High viz shirt but not always visible under the work shirt. When working along side a roadway or traffic area then hi-viz vest.
    Nitril gloves when climbing and leathers when i'm on the ground. Got to keep those hands soft and smooth or the wife will be using me as an exfoliator.
    Chainsaw pants, always. They go on before I leave home and come off when I get back. I don't even like doing a cat rescue without them on. Kinda feel naked...
    Chainsaw boots with steel toes.
     
  8. evo

    evo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    2,134
    Location:
    My Island, WA
    I worked on Vaseline ally in PDX for a little over three years. Tips were great! I made more there than tree work as a employee.

    There was one occasion where the crazy right wingers with blow horns showed up on the street corner. On the opposite drag queens were slipping off their high heals, and popping off the fake nails. PDX riot cops were called in... let me tell you, leather daddies and queens can bash back.
     
  9. evo

    evo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    2,134
    Location:
    My Island, WA
    Oh crap, we are back on subject now!

    Ok so for me just the basic ppe, hard hat, chaps, or saw pants ( thong under if I’m feeling frisky). I have both a visor and screen mesh on the helmet. Mesh is for when it’s raining, or the visor fogs up. Basically I learned that you jump out of the truck with your gloves on, hard hat/helmet stays on for the day, unless ground pruning weeping Japanese maples. I’ve become so accustomed to chaps or saw pants it’s just part of the uniform. I’ve worked many days in chaps with just felcos and a handsaw. It’s like wearing knee pads, and shin pads for all the weird contorted positions I find myself in. They are also fairly water resistant, where I can keep dry walking through under brush in the woods on wet days.
     
    treehumper likes this.
  10. southsoundtree

    southsoundtree Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Messages:
    4,197
    Location:
    Olympia, WA
    I realized that I've been training people on saw handling all wrong. I've been giving them a lightweight saw to follow along with, during instruction.

    I'm going to start having them hold/ swing around the MS660 with a 36" bar, rather than a ms 261/ 361 with a 20".

    Giving a heavy saw to handle while working on body positioning hopefully will force good ergonomics. Once they have some muscle memory built, they I'll try having them cut with a medium saw.
     
    TimBr, treehumper and kiteflyingeek like this.
  11. robinia

    robinia Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,254
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    That's a really great idea.
    Also bigger saws tend to get better respect. A little saw can much easier just feel like a toy.
    I really see the logic in this.
    ... but I'll probably go more midrange. 440 or something.
     
    Levi.CO likes this.
  12. Tom Dunlap

    Tom Dunlap Longest registered member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2001
    Messages:
    14,840
    Location:
    Retired in Minneapolis
    Over the years of seeing more and more basic ppe compliance what I've seen and heard is that starting to wear safety hats/helmets is the Gateway to a real safety awareness.
     
  13. climbingmonkey24

    climbingmonkey24 Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2017
    Messages:
    106
    Location:
    Ludlow
    If I wear gloves it's usually when the tree is down and we are doing cleanup or working with sappy pine. Just easier to tie knots / climb in general without them in my opinion.
     
  14. joezilla11

    joezilla11 Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2013
    Messages:
    335
    Location:
    Ohio
    I understand stand what ur saying but I’m not sure I agree with that totally. I just picture some young kid who doesn’t have the muscle memory or instinct for simple actions like using the chain break and doesn’t have the muscle stamina to maneuver a saw like that, just seems like an accident waiting to happen. But I’m sure u have good judgement I guess I’m just saying I wouldnt just throw the big saw at every new kid on every job. Did something happen to make u think ur not doing a good job on chainsaw training? Last week I had to show a kid how to
    hold and use a hammer, that blew my mind. Maybe it’s not u
     
    kiteflyingeek and macswan like this.
  15. treehumper

    treehumper Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2006
    Messages:
    6,453
    Location:
    Ridgefield, NJ
    Was talking to someone about hammers and how many young carpenters have never used them.
    But as for saws. For one teach them that the chainbrake is an inertial device. And I get the idea of putting a bigger saw in their hands to get them to realize what their really dealing with. Though a 440 would be plenty.
     
  16. southsoundtree

    southsoundtree Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Messages:
    4,197
    Location:
    Olympia, WA


    I see people holding saws like they're afraid of them. They hold them away from their bodies because they don't understand how to hold it close. I rest my saw on my body all them time (NOT the rookie bottom of the saw on my leg way). I use the corner/ side wrap handle on my left knee/ against my left knee, allowing me a tripod for stability (two arms and one knee). I can hold a heavy saw a 1/4" off the ground this way. If you're holding it away from your body, you're likely to hit dirt.

    I stabilize the saw by reaching in front of me, resting my elbow on my hip or leg, saw on its side.

    I taught a 5'2" former gymnast to run an MS 440. I tried to go with focusing on technique just as gymnasts are forced to do. On a loose, sloping mountainside. She took right to it. And then she ran it for the rest of her time there. We had half men/ half women sawyers.

    I'm talking about teaching someone to handle a heavy saw, then start them cutting with a lighter one. The 440s were the standard for the Conservation Corps. Almost all new sawyers used them. There were some 360s/ 036s.



    I'm not talking about some young kid, I'm talking about someone who has made it through a selection process, and who is going to be trained into being a sawyer. Before they've had a saw put in their hand for training, they've had safety pounded into them, like with a 15 pound sledge hammer worth of subtly. If they're the type to try to pound nails with the side of the hammer or the claw, they won't make it through the selection process.

    I haven't had any issues with people I've trained. One rookie went on to be a HotShot.
    I see the same issues, people using bad habits because they don't think they're going to drop through a cut an inch into the dirt. Better body positioning prevents this. People don't hold the saw by the balance points on the handle. People don't wrap their thumbs. People hold the saw away from their bodies because they don't understand how it works, when and where to expect it to various things, etc.


    I get asked how often I sharpened. I say that its when its needed, and rarely. I bought a roll of chain years ago, and still have most of it. Wood doesn't dull saws much. Gravel in the bark from hitting the ground, the occasional nail, etc, sure. Hitting the ground is a good way to go through chain and files in a hurry. No thanks. I can't remember the last time I filed a chain to the witness marks.

    Also, helps to have a mini-loader. Less bucking, more log loading.

    Root pruning and stump cuts ruin chains in a hurry. Add a rookie, and there's the trifecta for me sharpening (and teaching sharpening).
     
    Treetopflyer likes this.
  17. Tony

    Tony Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2002
    Messages:
    1,536
    Location:
    Lancaster, PA

    I see your point and perhaps it has merit. I don't know for sure, never tried it.

    I do however, do A LOT of chainsaw training. There is something macho about big saws. Lay three saws out of varying sizes and bar length and given a choice most men will gravitate to the largest. Women not so much. (I attribute that to being less influenced by other's explications of them.)

    The issue I have run into is when a student has a larger saw they wanna cut a larger tree! Not always a good idea, but most of the time "controllable" site permitting.

    The short story is, in my experience, a mid-size saw (40-50cc with and 16"-20" bar) works the best in most training scenarios with experienced and green students alike. What I consider more important than the size of the saw is my adherence to proper saw handling and ergonomic positioning. What I permit in class I condone. I emphasize to all classes that in training we strive for perfection. Not because it is obtainable, but, to paraphrase Vince Lombardi, the pursuit of perfection is how we achieve excellence.

    my .02

    Tony
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2017
    Mel and SomethingWitty like this.
  18. TimBr

    TimBr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    2,282
    Location:
    Northern Virginia
    I think "Stig" from the other forum actually had a friend who died from getting a nasty sliver in his hand that caused blood poisoning, in the end. No joke.

    Tim
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2017

Share This Page