More things broken

[yoyoman]

Thanks for the contributors, sorry it took me so long to get to them.

Splices, sewn eyes, hand sewn eyes, bridges, snap, carabiner


r and prusik cord.

 

[Jimmycrackcorn]

Very interesting.. Never seen Hand Sewn Cordage tested before...
What was the Cordage right before the Globe 3000? There was two of them.. Looked like either 8mm Rit or Bailout.. pretty drastic difference between them.. 5k on one & 8k+ on the next..

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[yoyoman]

Photo of them may help. Amazing for hand sewn eye.

 

[JeffGu]

What? A hand sewn eye didn't open up a black hole and suck the entire universe into it? Civilization as we know it didn't end, with millions of people falling out of trees and breaking their necks?

Must be a fluke... were you wearing your lucky boxer shorts and rubbing your lucky horseshoe?

 

[Crimsonking]

Richard, was the Reep Schnur used or new?

 

[Jimmycrackcorn]

What's now worthy is, there isn't a thousand stitches in them like you would get with a professionally sewn unit. That's what has always kept me from considering a DIY stitched cord.. for one, i thought it would take a week to get enough stitches in it to be legitimate & second, i always thought hand sewn was frowned upon & not to be trusted in life support..

Is that just regular whipping twine that's being used?

I wonder why the second broke that much higher, you think it was just a matter of the other one being used more/longer?

Like i said before.. very interesting.

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[Cereal_Killer]

Photo of them may help. Amazing for hand sewn eye.

Richard, on the 8104 test RIT, specifically the whipped end; if you feel through the cover where about did the core break in relation to the stitching*? Do you still have the two pieces in you possession and if so would it be possible to see a photo of them laid end to end (as it was before being broken) so I could get a better visual on where the cover / core failed in relation to each other and to the stitching. I'm very interested in hand stitching 8mm RIT.

*Let me word that question a different way, asking for the same info but when I proofread my post it came off a little confusing... Take the whipped end, run your fingers up the remaining cover, how far up from the stitching do you feel core remain?


BTW Who's is it, are they a member here? If so it'd be awesome if they'd add any thoughts about the process, maybe things like what needle, what thread, how far into the core they attempted to grab with each stitch.

 

[moss]

FFFFFF*******CK YEAAAAAH! Ok, sorry for my excitement. I've been through a lot of BS for my heavily documented hand-sewn eye technique. Nick Bonner I never met you but suck it. And I will gladly say that to your face (in a good way) if we ever meet.

See the hand-sewn eye documentation thread in the splicing forum. My contribution to the testing is the retired Velocity 11mm lanyard w/sewn eye. We didn't get to see the strength of the eye but you'll notice it didn't budge as the rope failed. The retired Reep Schnur Captain Hook hand-sewn eye, plus 1 year service, eye didn't budge. And what means the most to me: Ta-da, drum roll please: hand-sewn Globe 3000 bridge, retired, in service more than 4 years on and off on a Petzl Sequoia open ring bridge setup. On inspection I felt that it still had a life but out of due caution I retired it. Bridge broke plus 6000 lbs, sewn eyes didn't budge. Thank you Richard. I can send you a hand-sewn eye in Tachyon with (I hope) rope in good enough condition that we can find out the breaking strength of that eye. Based on testing before Richard's test the Tachyon eye will do very well.

Richard we've all known for a while that you are a treasure to the tree climber community, thank you again.

Edit: In all true seriousness, I actually have nothing against Nick Bonner, he rose up to symbolize attitude without investigation. Something we all have to deal with in all walks of life. Lessons learned, love ya Nick.

-Andrew Joslin

 

[moss]

Richard, was the Reep Schnur used or new?

It was mine, used but not beat up, was on a Captain Hook. I’m rethinking my use of Reep Schnur as a hook line. I know it’s not “life support” but... I believe the vector forces can get quite high when traversing with a hook under certain circumstances, especially if a RADS mechanical advantage is in the mix. And the picture of an uncontrolled swing back with a Reep Schnur cordage fail is not a pretty one. Not worried about the hand-sewn eye obviously ;-)
-AJ

 

[moss]

Ahh ha, probably just killed this thread, the armchair critics are temporarily stunned like a grenade was thrown in the water ;-) It will trickle in there just has to be a way to say “You’ll kill somebody if you keep this up”. Looking forward to intelligent discussion on all of the tests in Richard’s video.
-AJ

 

[Crimsonking]

It was mine, used but not beat up, was on a Captain Hook. I’m rethinking my use of Reep Schnur as a hook line. I know it’s not “life support” but... I believe the vector forces can get quite high when traversing with a hook under certain circumstances, especially if a RADS mechanical advantage is in the mix. And the picture of an uncontrolled swing back with a Reep Schnur cordage fail is not a pretty one. Not worried about the hand-sewn eye obviously ;-)
-AJ

My main friction saver is made from the stuff. Also rethinking. If I didn’t want to keep the thimbles, I’d send it to Richard to break.

I should add that I’m quite impressed by the hand sewn splices, AJ!

 

[Crimsonking]

AJ, have you hand-sewn sections of parallel core rope like htp? If so, have any that you would be willing to have tested?

 

[Jimmycrackcorn]

My main friction saver is made from the stuff. Also rethinking. If I didn’t want to keep the thimbles, I’d send it to Richard to break.

I should add that I’m quite impressed by the hand sewn splices, AJ!

I'm sure he'd send them back to you.. or would you not trust them after? Thimbles are pretty cheap anyways. You can get the Sterling style ones for like 5-7 a peice.. key word when searching is "Sailmaker" Thimble. I have yet to figure out the search word for the cool ART style or DMM thimbles though. Tried "Round Tunnel" but only got theirs..

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[Jimmycrackcorn]

Ahh ha, probably just killed this thread
-AJ

Umm... Well yeeah.. no shit you probably did.. you just flat out told a big $$ sponsor to blow you.. & then doubled down on it.. lol. Thing will probably go defcon 5 lockdown...lol..


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[moss]

AJ, have you hand-sewn sections of parallel core rope like htp? If so, have any that you would be willing to have tested?

I'd happy to take a go at it. Haven't sewn HTP, I have sewn PMI EZ-Bend, not sure how similar or dissimilar the core configuration is. -AJ

 

[Brocky]

It's my understanding that the term laid core is the type in HTP, other static, and dynamic ropes. There are various number of twisted strands that make up the core. The only true parallel core that I can think of is Sta-Set X. When you pull it's core out it resembles a horse's tail, single, thin strands, with no twisting.

The sewing on the hitch cords that are different than the machine type is very interesting. Seems to be a whole different way of doing it.

 

[moss]

It's my understanding that the term laid core is the type in HTP, other static, and dynamic ropes. There are various number of twisted strands that make up the core. The only true parallel core that I can think of is Sta-Set X. When you pull it's core out it resembles a horse's tail, single, thin strands, with no twisting.

The sewing on the hitch cords that are different than the machine type is very interesting. Seems to be a whole different way of doing it.

Thx for the clarification on parallel core etc. I've looked at HTP core and didn't recognize it as looking substantially different than other static/kernmantle style cores I've looked at.

Yes, I'm also interested in what the materials and methods were for hand-sewn eyes that held up into the 8000 lb plus range. There seemed to be a fair amount of movement in the two sides of the cordage but it didn't seem to matter. That falls under the "cycles to failure" dept., ie: over time does that kind of movement cause problems under normal load and reload cycles?
-AJ

 

[Stephen Moore]

It was mine, used but not beat up, was on a Captain Hook. I’m rethinking my use of Reep Schnur as a hook line. I know it’s not “life support” but... I believe the vector forces can get quite high when traversing with a hook under certain circumstances, especially if a RADS mechanical advantage is in the mix. And the picture of an uncontrolled swing back with a Reep Schnur cordage fail is not a pretty one. Not worried about the hand-sewn eye obviously ;-)
-AJ

I would think, being optimistic of course, that static loading would be well below the rated max in a traverse. It may not handle dynamic loading to your specific needs?

 

[Stephen Moore]

We entrust our lives to these ropes and devices, also our workers and the clients property. For the sake of a few hundred dollars for new rope, I refuse to use worn looking or abused rope. It gets chopped and becomes utility rope that would be to short for climbing applications.

 

[moss]

I would think, being optimistic of course, that static loading would be well below the rated max in a traverse. It may not handle dynamic loading to your specific needs?

It would be worth looking at one of those static load vector charts or apps, if the angles become too shallow even a static load can jack up pretty high. I believe this more likely a potential issue if MA like a RADS is used on the hook line and the rope angles are driven too shallow. Good opportunity to measure with a load cell to see what’s what.
-AJ