Is this safe?

Cereal_Killer

Active Member
I've been thinking about an idea for an easier to use by my 7 year old rope walker system. What I notice with my kids is they have the hardest time with the knee ascender so I was trying to come up with a way to use two foot ascenders at once and if I could somehow secure the rope to the TIP so that either leg could be weighted independently I think it would work pretty well.

So I thought and thought and came up with this and it does work but is it safe to climb either leg of the rope? In use the device would go on the normal side (side with the pully) but for my test I attached to the AB side and, well, I'm alive...

Ground retrievability is not so much an issue (but by all means, if there's a better way to accomplish this that is ground retrievable please let me know)!
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climbstihl

Well-Known Member
I'd do it, but I would probably replace the biner with a screwlink, and I'd only attach to the side with the prusik, just using the other side for the one foot ascender. You can unclutter the whole thing by getting rid of the pulley, running the rope through the biner or link, letting that tend the prusik.
 

Jan_

Active Member
It's awesome that you're teaching your kids how to climb, wish my dad could do that (It's actually the other way around).
I think what you came up with is safe, but may be hard to use for you kids too because the ropes would move away from each other if you try to load them. Have you thought about maybe using a hand ascender instead of a foot ascender, that should be easier, depending on how high they can reach to get enough clearence from their device.
 
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Cereal_Killer

Active Member
I haven't had him try a hand ascender with footloop yet, he's on a RADS system now and asked specifically to do it like I do (rope walker) so I started thinking about this.

I did come up with an dead simple way to get the 2 independent legs; put a bight of rope over the TIP and girth hitch it. Is that safe without some sort of backup knot at the girth hitch? Would joining the two legs at the ground close the system to make it safer? It would eliminate the movement you mention when weighting opposite legs. One problem with this way is its take another entire length of rope more (25% more rope) then the above system which already required 3 times the length of rope as your TIP is high.

@climbstihl I'll try your modifications next time, thanks for the pointers!
 

Jan_

Active Member
A girth hitch seems like an unsafe way to do it, it might slip if only one side is loaded. The only way to stop the legs (both rope and human in this case) from seperating I can think of would be by putting a base tie on both ends and tensioning the rope, this would also eliminate the need for a canopy TIP and reduce rope usage to 2x the TIP height.
 

evo

Well-Known Member
The only issue I really see is this might not allow for a tight choke on the limb. The weight of the climber could cause the prussic to rub and slip a little. It wouldn’t be a big deal.
I don’t like carabiners outta reach or sight others are comfortable with it.

Seems over complicated, I’d just use a bowline, alpine, or screw link. Keep it simple and don’t fix it unless it’s broke
 

climbstihl

Well-Known Member
Thinking about it further, why make it so complicated? Just make an alpine in the middle of the rope and run both sides through. Still not sure if the two foot ascender method will work well though.
Sorry about the photo, I don't have rope and or tree limbs in the hotel...20190624_183141.jpg
 

fall_risk

Well-Known Member
To make your current system retrievable, take off the pulley and biner, replace with a rated screw link as suggested above, and move the pulley/biner above the prussik, and tie a retrieval line to the biner, 6-8 millimeter stuff works well and is cheap, but try to find something static-ish. Anything you've got laying around will work. Then you can use the pulley to tend the prussik back down to you. Even slicker, capture a ring or rated screw link in your prussik loop, choke the static side in the ring/link, and retrieve the same way. There's a similar system in one of the Taylor Hamel Teufelberger videos:
(around 5:06)
You can make a double choked alpine butterfly or figure eight on a bight retrievable by clipping a retrieval line to the loop of the knot.
Sent from my E6910 using Tapatalk
 

Jehinten

Well-Known Member
I second the midline knot and run both legs through it, it will also cinch to the limb better this way. A figure 8 on a bight or alpine butterfly would work.

If you do use the system that you showed, I'd recommend attaching the prussik cord on the carabiner or screw link through the pulley plates. Just to keep it loaded evenly and help it keep its orientation.
 

Chaplain242

Well-Known Member
I second the midline knot and run both legs through it, it will also cinch to the limb better this way. A figure 8 on a bight or alpine butterfly would work.

If you do use the system that you showed, I'd recommend attaching the prussik cord on the carabiner or screw link through the pulley plates. Just to keep it loaded evenly and help it keep its orientation.
+1 on the alpine, but if loading both legs instead of using fig 8 better to use figure 9
 
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