Friction Hitch Questions

Brocky

Well-Known Member
#1
image.jpeg image.jpeg Does anyone know if this is the way to tie the friction hitch that came from Matt Cornell that Steve showed recently in the Rope Wrench thread? The first picture is what I think is a dressed and set example and the second is a loosely tie one to better show how it's tied.

My second question is, do you think an SRT friction hitch, the holy grail, is still desirable or relevant in this New Age of Mechanicals? Not something partnered with something else like the Wrench or Hiker, but just a hitch.
 

SomethingWitty

Well-Known Member
#2
View attachment 39829 View attachment 39830 Does anyone know if this is the way to tie the friction hitch that came from Matt Cornell that Steve showed recently in the Rope Wrench thread? The first picture is what I think is a dressed and set example and the second is a loosely tie one to better show how it's tied.

My second question is, do you think an SRT friction hitch, the holy grail, is still desirable or relevant in this New Age of Mechanicals? Not something partnered with something else like the Wrench or Hiker, but just a hitch.
Yes. I have played on a hitch-only SRT setup that worked beautifully. $15 worth of hrc lasts for weeks and gives you easy slack in the same fashion as a mechanical (as opposed to the wrench, where you still have to lean against the wrench).
The action was great, and I can buy a lot of string for $350.


No idea about the matt cornell stuff.

Edit: It is also nice to be able to pack lighter, not ever have parts to lose, and get people set up on SRT with something affordable that is similar feeling to what they are used to. The wrench weirded me out.
 
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Brocky

Well-Known Member
#4
@SomethingWitty, do you use your SRT hitch or do you use something else now? I have been using a hitch only for a few years and haven't tried any of the mechanicals to know how it compares. The hitch I use acts almost like a one on DdRT, with just a little more difficulty in starting to descend.


It's interesting that HRC works for you, as I thought the cover had too loose of a braid and would create too much of a footprint on the rope. But now that I think about it I was using a hitch cord that I spliced and maybe I hadn't correctly figured the amount of cover I needed for the second splice, and added too much. I'll have to look at it again. I ended up using Sterling accessory cord, which works good but is only nylon, so I started putting a vectran core in the accessory cord cover.
 

SomethingWitty

Well-Known Member
#5
@SomethingWitty, do you use your SRT hitch or do you use something else now? I have been using a hitch only for a few years and haven't tried any of the mechanicals to know how it compares. The hitch I use acts almost like a one on DdRT, with just a little more difficulty in starting to descend.


It's interesting that HRC works for you, as I thought the cover had too loose of a braid and would create too much of a footprint on the rope. But now that I think about it I was using a hitch cord that I spliced and maybe I hadn't correctly figured the amount of cover I needed for the second splice, and added too much. I'll have to look at it again. I ended up using Sterling accessory cord, which works good but is only nylon, so I started putting a vectran core in the accessory cord cover.
I think I remember your splicework throwing me off a couple of months ago because of the mismatched cover and core.

I don't use a srt hitch. I have a RR that really helped me become comfortable on SRT and a wrench that I need to play on more because the RR isn't allowed in comp. My buddy showed me an SRT hitch a while ago and I was sceptical until I set it. It functioned beautifully. We played with it all day.
 

TimBr

Well-Known Member
#7
Yes. I have played on a hitch-only SRT setup that worked beautifully. $15 worth of hrc lasts for weeks and gives you easy slack in the same fashion as a mechanical (as opposed to the wrench, where you still have to lean against the wrench).
The action was great, and I can buy a lot of string for $350.


No idea about the matt cornell stuff.

Edit: It is also nice to be able to pack lighter, not ever have parts to lose, and get people set up on SRT with something affordable that is similar feeling to what they are used to. The wrench weirded me out.
SomethingWitty, please forgive my slow mind. Are you saying that you somehow managed to find a hitch, hitch cord and rope combination that allowed you to operate in SRT mode without the benefit of a secondary device to share friction with the hitch?

If yes, this is the first time I've ever read of someone managing to do so. The need or desire to share friction with the hitch to enable a hitch to function in SRT was the thing that caused Kevin Bingham to have his brilliant flash of imagination, and come up with the Rope Wrench, if I'm remembering the story correctly.

I always thought a hitch would bind up tight without something to share friction. Heck, there's a thread on this forum that tries to address the issue of hitch binding even when a friction sharing device is in play. So I'd love to hear more of what you have to say on this issue.

A photo or even just a good description of the climbing hitch you like to use, along with your preferred rope, would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance for any response you choose to give.

Tim
 

SomethingWitty

Well-Known Member
#8
SomethingWitty, please forgive my slow mind. Are you saying that you somehow managed to find a hitch, hitch cord and rope combination that allowed you to operate in SRT mode without the benefit of a secondary device to share friction with the hitch?

If yes, this is the first time I've ever read of someone managing to do so. The need or desire to share friction with the hitch to enable a hitch to function in SRT was the thing that caused Kevin Bingham to have his brilliant flash of imagination, and come up with the Rope Wrench, if I'm remembering the story correctly.

I always thought a hitch would bind up tight without something to share friction. Heck, there's a thread on this forum that tries to address the issue of hitch binding even when a friction sharing device is in play. So I'd love to hear more of what you have to say on this issue.

A photo or even just a good description of the climbing hitch you like to use, along with your preferred rope, would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance for any response you choose to give.

Tim

That, Tim, is exactly what I am saying.
The effect is similar to a HH except the additional squeeze below the hitch is made from that same piece of cord.
I've been having trouble finding the video of the guy explaining it. I'll go see my buddy steven and see about getting y'all some pics and maybe a video today.
 

SomethingWitty

Well-Known Member
#10
Please pardon the dull voice and 16 minutes of talking. The guy is pretty genius.
The key part is the bottom of the hitch. I was running with a distel tied up top falling into his little friction bars on kernmaster (i think).
The hitch is smaller than the video makes it look. Next to a RW tied up it is pretty similarly sized.
It seems to have to be loaded to set everything in place after tying (I couldn't tend it until I loaded it but then it was beautiful).

If this rain stops soon, I'll get some good shots of playing with it, limb walking out and in and such.
 

SomethingWitty

Well-Known Member
#13
@SomethingWitty, do you use your SRT hitch or do you use something else now? I have been using a hitch only for a few years and haven't tried any of the mechanicals to know how it compares. The hitch I use acts almost like a one on DdRT, with just a little more difficulty in starting to descend.


It's interesting that HRC works for you, as I thought the cover had too loose of a braid and would create too much of a footprint on the rope. But now that I think about it I was using a hitch cord that I spliced and maybe I hadn't correctly figured the amount of cover I needed for the second splice, and added too much. I'll have to look at it again. I ended up using Sterling accessory cord, which works good but is only nylon, so I started putting a vectran core in the accessory cord cover.
What hitch are you running? Your experience with hitch-only SRT sounds much more extensive than mine.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
#14
image.jpeg image.jpeg image.jpeg
This is what I use, a slightly modified vt. I went the same way as your friend at first by going long to introduce more friction. They would work at first but most would tighten up with the tails getting longer until the hitch locked up after repeated ascending and descending. The pictures show the front, side and back views. The knot is just an overhand with the tails. I tried various other knots but they wouldn't tighten up until a load was applied and then one leg would be longer than the other.

Thanks @SomethingWitty for posting that video. So you don't need the ring that your buddy shows?

Thanks @N.e.Tree for verifying that it is the correct way to tie it. It was hard to tell from the pictures that @Steve Connally showed in the other thread. Do you know if there is an official name for it?

Edit: Sorry, but the pictures are back, side and than front.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
#16
Yes Stuart it does after a climb, but not so much you need a tool to undo it. The knot also regulates how much friction the wraps, or round turns, get by positioning it higher or lower. Too low and it won't bite easily after being loosened. Too high and it gets hard to descend, like a typical friction hitch.
 

SomethingWitty

Well-Known Member
#18
View attachment 39845 View attachment 39844 View attachment 39843
This is what I use, a slightly modified vt. I went the same way as your friend at first by going long to introduce more friction. They would work at first but most would tighten up with the tails getting longer until the hitch locked up after repeated ascending and descending. The pictures show the front, side and back views. The knot is just an overhand with the tails. I tried various other knots but they wouldn't tighten up until a load was applied and then one leg would be longer than the other.

Thanks @SomethingWitty for posting that video. So you don't need the ring that your buddy shows?

Thanks @N.e.Tree for verifying that it is the correct way to tie it. It was hard to tell from the pictures that @Steve Connally showed in the other thread. Do you know if there is an official name for it?

Edit: Sorry, but the pictures are back, side and than front.
Never bothered trying the ring.
That was just a video that Steven showed me almost a year ago. That guy is quite an innovator for someone who isn't a pro climber.
I'm about to go run several hundred feet on that hitch in the picture with the rope wrench to see if it binds up on a good stiff static rope.

I'm digging the econo-hitchhiker effect in your hitch. I will certainly be playing with it.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
#19
I think all the tying after the wraps that your friend's has does the same thing as the overhand knot on mine. The repeatition probably prevents it from binding up.. I don't know, I was fooled many times!
 

SomethingWitty

Well-Known Member
#20
I am going to start seriously running these knots.

This one was leggy. I shortened it and then played around.
Once I figure out how to put videos somewhere from my phone, I'll show y'all how super responsive that particular edition of that helux hitch is... and how much I have never played in that tree before. :risas:
It's about the hitch though, not my climbing, right?
 

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