Footlock Prusik

#1
I'd like to start accessing trees by footlocking on a doubled line like in the footlock event. Right now I climb on 11.5mm Lava. I'm 5'10 and weigh about 140-145. Any advice on length and thickness of prusik cord to get, or descender? I've heard good things about the rescue 8, but am open to sugestions.

Thanks guys!
 

Tom Dunlap

Here from the beginning
#2
My view of tree climbers using eights or similar descenders isn't main stream.

Tree climbers have muscle memory that teaches 'let go/lock off' Using descenders is opposite. That's a dangerous approach...to me...and some others.

I've got several descenders that work well. They're barely used and for sale at a reasonable price. Most are single rope tools, a couple work on doubled.

If you're going to use an eight type device you should study backups carefully. Some 'backups' give a false sense of security.
 
#3
Okay. Thanks for the input Tom. Do you have a link I can follow to find the descenders you have for sale that work on doubled rope?
 

SeanRuel

Active Member
#5
I'd buy about 12 feet of ice line, 8mm 12 stand hollow braid. Enough for spliced or tied prussic.

Take a piece of line tied to your normal bridge connection, and raise your hand up as high as you can. Mark the line at that point and add a few inches. That's where the eye of a spliced foot lock prussic should start.

You want the prussic top out of your hands reach. To descend, install and lock off fig 8, take a footlock up and grab your hitch. Slack it off and put your weight on the 8. With one hand unlock the 8, with other run the hitch. If you freak and let go, hitch will grab again, lock off 8 and repeat.

Fig 8 with ears is easier to lock off.
 

Tom Dunlap

Here from the beginning
#6
@SeanRuel ...why do you want the top of the prusik top to be out of reach?

To me...if a climber is hanging or partly incapacitated they need to reach up to release and rapell down. With the top out of reach release is difficult
 

SeanRuel

Active Member
#7
Don't want to release hitch when you think it should be holding, as could happen if you get excited and over reach and sit back.
 
#8
Tom,

Why do you view climbers using a figure 8 as not mainstream? I've used 8s for years and see no reason to abandon them. Most of our use is for a climber putting on slings for a crane. What else would work better than an 8 for this? Sometimes we're zipping down from around 100 ft up. A rack is to bulky for me. You can kill a hitch cord in a day of crane work easily.
 

Tom Dunlap

Here from the beginning
#9
It is mainstream...i have a different stance.

People smarter than me taught me a long time ago to pay attention to muscle memory. It was first shown to me as a junior in high school on the gymnastics team. I watched my team mate /co-captain/senior perfect his set and win first in state on pommel horse. He would chalk spots on the horse as targets for hishand in order to hit a move. That taught me what it takes to do do a winning set without thinking. the move has been absorbed into muscel memory. No need to think just put your body in motion. I've watched many ITCC/Comp climbers in the Masters who are looking five moves ahead of themselves. Their body is playing catch up...automatically. Two seperate entities in one.

OK...still here?

There is a drill that is used in knot tying... in order to pass the test certain knots must be tied with a blindfold on. Test muscle memory. What does it feel like? One student asked me why. My answer,,,becuase there will be a summer day when the sweat in your eyes is burning and you can't see 100% clear. Tie the knot and check it by feel and visualize too...slow, but it can be done. Then, next winter when the air temp is -10F and your hands are numb..t.hey will remember how to tie

Now...using an 8? our climbing systems, hitch, mulitcender or ascender/descender...RADS... are all based on a let go/lock off and you won't fall. Agreed?

In an emergency or other situation there is lots to keep track of. Why task our brainwith trying to remember which system we're using? My preference has to stay with let go/lock off and configure the gear to fit.

During my career I was only in a couple of critical situations where i had to trust my muscle memory to auto-pilot while my conscious mind took care of the task at hand. I'm glad i didn't need to be aware of which system i was using.

What has concerned me is that I;ve been climbing on SRT systems for about 25 years and not using a DdRT system. The exception is the occasional time when i DdRT on the tail of my rope when I need a DRT system. I have to pay close attention because that is NOT as automatic as it once was.

Taking variables out of complex systems makes them safe or more successful. My team mate taught me that when he would change a chalk mark by 1/4" increments...in order to win state in one of the most competitive state gymnastics program in the US

Just food for thought...ingest if you want.
 

Tom Dunlap

Here from the beginning
#10
My fav double rope descender is the Hewbolt.

Go to Gary Storricks site or Google Hewbolt.

Very simple and a let go/lock off device. It has to be used with the proper HMS biner...one with a straight upper portion NOT rounded.

Through a half hitch over it and it is locked off.
 

Tony

Well-Known Member
#11
@SeanRuel ...why do you want the top of the prusik top to be out of reach?

To me...if a climber is hanging or partly incapacitated they need to reach up to release and rapell down. With the top out of reach release is difficult
Not so much that is it out of reach. A more apt description would be long enough your hands fit under the knot. Train yourself to keep them there.

I will also add other than a long enough prussic cord and a reliable self rescue system; be aware of sticks and leaves or other stuff jamming the top of the knot as you ascend. Use a three wrap or six coil knot and watch rope spread at the top of the climb. As the knot is pushed into a rope forced apart by the anchor it will not reliably grab.

Tony
 

Mowerr

Active Member
#12
Use a rappel ring with appropriate biner, I like to use my dmm revolver and a cheap Rapp ring, usually as back up for zz. Rapp rings I got cheap from a mountain climbing store. Omega pacific is the brand , rated 20kn, or sometimes a large dmm anchor ring.
 

evo

Well-Known Member
#13
@Tony Choke the rope with a butterfly on the TIP lines will lay fair and avoid spreading out rendering the prussic unless.

@Tom Dunlap I agree with your point, but disagree with this application. Change over is where the risk is, adding a 8 below the footlock prussic is simply adding a descender underneath a backup. It should pass the whistle test. Now bombing out of a spar on a choked single line with nothing other than a 8 is a point where your argument is very valid. I always have a 8 on my saddle as a backup, only used it a few times but never for an emergency. An 8 can work very well for low to steep angle bluff rappels on a access line, but that's a whole different game.
 

Tony

Well-Known Member
#14
@Tony Choke the rope with a butterfly on the TIP lines will lay fair and avoid spreading out rendering the prussic unless.
If the anchor is isolated. If you have enough line. A great technique, but a climber must understand the concepts of the system and how it functions.

Footlocking like all 1:1 asccent is an awesome tool. As always know the limitations, plan accordingly

Tony
 

evo

Well-Known Member
#15
If the anchor is isolated. If you have enough line. A great technique, but a climber must understand the concepts of the system and how it functions.

Footlocking like all 1:1 asccent is an awesome tool. As always know the limitations, plan accordingly

Tony
Well we are talking about foot locking.. so yes isolated tip, and two ends reaching the ground. Choke that chit
 

Tom Dunlap

Here from the beginning
#16
I keep a large ISC biner on my harness. Many uses including a Munter rappel. I like having multifunction gear. An eight is pretty much a single use tool which needs a biner too. I read a friction test of various eights and munters. In the tests the munters had more friction than eights.
 
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