Arboreal Symbiotic Integration Harnesses

jomoco

Active Member
Nice try TF.

Any failure of any component of my ASSIH system will result in what? A few bruised and battered plants?

No damage to the tree will occur. None of the suspended plants will be over people or walkways. They will be suspended over cactus gardens and other exotic plant containers, watering them as well with run off.

The client knows exactly what her liabilities are, as well as the maintenance schedule for the system.

The difference between private property installations and high pedestrian traffic public parks and community areas will be a guiding factor in whether or not the system is appropriate for use in trees in that area?

My system does not weaken trees, it strengthens them. Like an athlete doing seasonal weightlifting to gain strength and mass.

Like I said, I'm simply mimicking the natural annual fruit burdening process to strengthen the trees wood structure, albeit artificially, the logic and reaction wood stimulus process is the same.

My system does the exact opposite of the Cobra system. This system burdens the tree, the opposite of supporting it, see?

jomoco
 

SRTsteve860

Active Member
More of a question about choosing the tree as opposed to the system you are using:

I am not familiar with the species, is it naturally fruit bearing? If it isn't, how successful will it be placing only a few substantial masses on the limbs, as opposed to many distributed smaller masses that will more mimic fruit. You might be beefing up the unions between the limbs you place weight on and the trunk... but since no load will be on the branch between the tips and the affixed weight, wont these follow regular growth and not become stronger?

If this is the case... might this be detrimental to the limb in the long run: with "natural strength" limb tips, but more strong and rigid butt sections... would this create a stronger shear and bending moment around the location of the weight (years after this was done) much like a fishing rod with a fast tip, but stiff backbone... you can load the lower section with much weight, but if stressed over the entire length, the weaker area will be the failure point.

-Steve
 

jomoco

Active Member
Very good questions Steve.

There's no doubt that my system is a very poor and limited imitation of true fruit burdening that occurs throughout the entire wood structure naturally.

However limited and poor this system will admittedly be, it does make physiological sense in the logic behind the reaction wood triggering process it mimicks so poorly.

And since the other two reels for this first prototype just arrived today, and no plants have yet been hung in any location in the Tipu tree?

I would ask you to be patient enough to wait until you see the finished installation and where the plants get hung from to determine whether they are optimally located to strengthen as much of the leaders as possible without risking branch failure?

I'm thinking 3 inch diameter lateral is good for up to 50 lbs, effectively a 25 lb hanging plant coming off the pulley.

I plan to start installing this system on Thursday.

I'd also like to thank Tree Frog for suggesting rated steel cables be used in this system. Because small stainless steel cables inside the water delivery lines would be an excellent way to increase this systems durability and longevity before any replacement lines are needed.

But that'll have to wait until the second prototype is put together.

Should be an interesting project, and thread.

Thanks for your imput guys.

jomoco
 

jomoco

Active Member
Here I am on Thursday, buying hundreds of feet of1/8 inch OD plastic coated wire rope to thread inside my 1/4 inch ID braided polyethylene water delivery lines, just to be on the safe side of professionalism, despite the increased cost in materials time and labor.

Each reel has 4 fifty foot lines coming off them. So by threading one hundred foot plastic coated wire rope inside two hoses through the reel axis itself, I can thread 4 fifty foot delivery lines with 2 one hundred foot cables.



Reminds me of the old Sneaky Pete automotive crank seal replacement tool.

Thanks a lot Tree Frog, for "spurring" me into action....I think?

jomoco
 

jomoco

Active Member
Well I'm one third through this project today.











There are two heavy duty tension springs inside that black corrugated tubing to allow for trunk diameter expansion. Sets of two in each tube for a total of four.





Way more complex than I initially envisioned.

jomoco
 

jomoco

Active Member
Finally finished this job today!

Three reels, twelve hanging baskets, all plumbed and ready to rock.







jomoco
 

oceans

Well-Known Member
Jomoco, you are one truly creative cat. You are probably already aware of that! I get a kick out of your energy and enthusiasm. You sure do realize a great number of ideas. Keep it up!
 

jomoco

Active Member
Thanks Oceans.

I'm pleased with the system, but more importantly the client is very happy and satisfied.

However to truly do the system right, to the point that a frail little old lady could swap out plants with no problem?

Each reel needs its own ratcheting mechanism, as well as a 5-1 gear reduction unit.

A manual boat trailer winch with a huge reel?

Fortunately this client has a very capable husband and young son to do the plant swapping when needed.

I'd like to do a really big tree with stacked and sequentially staggered rows of reels encompassing the entire base up to 12 feet up. Maybe a huge Torrey pine in La Jolla?

jomoco
 

oceans

Well-Known Member
I would love to see footage of the system on a windy day. I can imagine that the dynamics would get so much more complicated than normal, and the plants would actually act as additional dampening. Perhaps it's a prescription for a lion-tailed limb!
 

jomoco

Active Member
I just now found a free PDF link to a subject I find fascinating as well as pertinent to my project, the natural welding together, or grafting that occurs naturally in many tree species.

http://naturaculture.sites.go1.com.au/si...f-Myrtaceae.pdf

I love the idea of forced grafting of crossover branching to enhance a tree's structural stability.

For instance, this Chorissia speciosa has a small leader on its left side that arches back enough to crossover the tree's dominant central leader. That crossover is only a little over an inch in diameter compared to the central Leander's diameter of 3 inches.

I want to drill and fuse those two branches together with either a plastic or wooden dowel, enough so that plastic washers and nuts can mechanically squeeze them together long enough to promote their fusing together sooner than might occur naturally over time.

This contradicts many pruning standards, which may be why it interests me so much!



jomoco
 

KellyG

Member
Hello to all, I am new to the board and have been following this thread and would like to throw my hat in the ring in regards to static vs dynamic systems. I have been in this business for about 25 years and have put what seems like miles of steel cable in trees and have also put my fair share of cobra systems up as well. Each of these systems has a place in arboriculture however , only in an extreme case should they be installed to be structural. Whenever an arborist is dealing with a tree that has structural issues that warrant a ridgid cable ,thru-bolts etc.,it is advised to be in " cover your " mode and make sure you educate your client of the risks associated with keeping a tree with a known defect ,document the correct recommendations and have your client sign off on it . Obviously, a steel system would be the best choice in this case due to its strength characteristics .
In regards to any cable system, they should never be installed under load or at tension . To reduce any portion of a trees ability to flex and absorb energy is a recipe for failure. I have witnessed cabled tree failures and 9 times out of 10 it is usually at a point just above an overtensioned cable.This cable may have been installed correctly to begin with however, as the tree grows in height , diameter and weight advantage these systems become tighter . This also reduces the trees' ability to recognize its need for compression or reaction wood . With that being said ,even a steel system that is in pristine condition needs to be removed every now and then and a new system ,at the "proper" tension re- installed. This brings up an advantage to the Cobra systems simplicity to adjustment without a complete "do-over" .
In my opinion, the biggest advantage of any properly installed system is that it helps prohibit the portions of the tree to flex and bend in opposition to each other. When a tree is moving in different directions energy and shock loading compounds with leverage and severely stresses branch unions and crotches . A properly cabled tree is just "safeR " since those forces are reduced when the tree and its components are moving in unison.
Just my 2 cents worth.....
 

jomoco

Active Member
You state that "In regards to any cable system, they should never be installed under load or at tension."

Care to elaborate on exactly what you mean by that Kelly?

Are you advocating installing slack cables that can jackhammer a system apart?

All my systems are installed and adjusted to a uniform tautness invaraiiably.

You do not address the subject of polypropylene's weaknesses and vulnerabilies to natural elements when compared to galvanized steel systems at all.

Nor do you address the subject of when to cable?

Are you old school and only cable to help support an identifiable flaw in the tree's structure?

Or are you new school and feel it's okay to cable a tree for a perceived structural weakness, like a very long and heavy lateral branch?

jomoco
 

KellyG

Member
Not at all advocating slack systems at all however a cable that is guitar string tight and prohibits flex and the trees ability to absorb and distribute energy has a higher probability of failure at the cable and can be counterproductive.
True , synthetic systems have been known to suffer damage from squirrels and would be susceptible to fire damage ( probably a bigger problem here than a burnt Cobra )
I only recommend cable systems on trees that have structural flaws or conditions that warrant installation. Of course, I rely on my experience and professional knowledge to evaluate every situation and the variables are much too extensive to write in this post.
Am I old school or new school? Don't know exactly -but definately an "Old Dog"
 

jomoco

Active Member
There are good reasons that utility infrastructure companies don't use polypropylene in any of their permanent installations, period.

It's frailty whether in terms of rodents chewing, rubbing branch abrasion, or low temp melting point, all beg the same question?

How can you legally justify replacing something with a very high resistance to all three of these natural environmental elements, with something so much more vulnerable, weak and inferior for an overhead high pedestrian infrastructure application?

How do you think each of your liability insurance carriers will react to such an appalling lack of common sense on your part when presented with a claim in court?

jomoco
 

jomoco

Active Member
Don't feel too bad mate.

My observation was addressed to a general population of CA's, not you in particular although you admit to installing dynamic cabling systems as well.

What I'd like any cobra advocate to do however is explain their rationale for using a dynamic system over a static steel system if they are indeed trying to lend supplemental structural support to a real flaw?

These supports whether static or dynamic are still something the tree becomes dependent on for life regardless of which system initiates that dependence sooner?

The pertinent question is which system is rugged enough to last a few decades?

Science and common sense both say galvanized steel systems can take it far longer than polypropylene can, against a broader range of natural elements common to the tree's environment.

jomoco
 

jomoco

Active Member
Spring seems to have busted out in all its silken glory today.




I think it's safe to assume that after these heavy seed pods have cast their weights to the wind, the branches will rise a few inches, as the process of branch structure strengthening through weight burdening takes its natural course so gracefully.

jomoco
 
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