Addressing hitch binding with the Rope Wrench on descent

Discussion in 'Stationary Rope Technique-Half the rope, twice the' started by moss, Feb 4, 2016.

  1. TimBr

    TimBr Well-Known Member

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    Hey, colb! Welcome to the TreeBuzz forum. There's a lot of really helpful folks here. (I just noticed you've been a member for awhile; nice to see you posting here lately.)

    Thanks for the thorough introduction to yourself.

    I'll probably have to re-read your post before I come up with any additional comments, but the one thing that stood out to me about your setup as being possibly problematic is your use of a 2nd biner for your Rope Wrench stiff tether.

    @countryboypa31 is a world class climber, and he produced this youtube video that tries to explain why he thinks your configuration might be a mistake, and how to do it differently. Here's the link to his video.

    https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=nhQTBe2OPvQ

    I hope this helps.

    Also, you should read this thread, and then go watch all of the rest of Tony Knight's videos.

    http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/threads/flex-tether-for-the-rope-wrench.24530/

    That's all for now.

    Tim
     
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  2. colb

    colb Well-Known Member

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    Appreciate it, fellas. Time to learn how to tie a rope bridge knot - nothing like making your own life support (nervous lol)!

    Oceans, no need to explain why the epiCORD is a go-to. I'll look forward to comparing them firsthand. I'm going to be a little curious until I try it.

    Off topic, I'm trying to order 600 ft. of 9/16th all gear dyneema for a 90°-off-lean hazard 24" dbh Laurel oak drop. I want the line anyways for speed lining/block-and-run/winching off roofs/pulling trees in pastures/etc. The tree is hanging over a shack at 15°. I've gotten pretty good at deploying a 30 ton truck bottle jack with wedges to mitigate against jack failure. Figuring to basket the rope around an upper limb or two and send the ends back to a porty and grcs bollard on a pair of live oaks 200 ft. away. Tie off the Laurel oak butt several times to another nearby Laurel oak with heavy lean away from the shack with my cheap 3/4" Samson bull rope so it can't smack the shack upon rebound. Anyone ever done this? Does it go well? It's basically a controlled drop at 90° off lean. My friend and I understand the future status of the shack is a bit speculative, lol. Basically, I'm trying to match the tensile strengths and weights in the entire system, partly by avoiding knots. I'm figuring ~35,000lbs of tensile strength is enough to get it down while it's being supported by its own stump too. The figuring is not based on swl - just wl, because the consequences of failure are low (tree is going to crunch the shack anyways). Just worried about the ground bounce loading things... If the canopy crunch absorbs the impact and the butt comes off without slack, it may all rest pretty soft. Anyhow, I'll shoot to throw the epiCORD into that TS order.

    Good times!
     
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  3. colb

    colb Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Tim, I'll check those out!
     
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  4. swingdude

    swingdude De' Island Buzzer

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    Ditch the extra biner on the tether..connect tether between one eye and hitchclimber....also my vote is a 28" epi 10mm with a 3/3 VT....
     
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  5. colb

    colb Well-Known Member

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    Hey, Swingdude, thanks for your input. To follow up explicitly on "connect tether between one eye and hitchclimber", 1.) does the "one eye" fit as most tethers directly on the rw (as mine is in my picture), and 2.) what is the most compact, safe, preferred connection method between the tether and the hitchclimber pulley? I've seen so many tethers and tether widgets by now that it's getting a little crowded in my head, lol.

    For curiousity sake, what's to stop one from putting a pulley with an open axle, or abr ring directly around the rope bridge? I know there's a premium on frictionless hardware that prohibits the abr ring from being seriously considered, but would it be that hard to design a pulley that fits around a rope?

    Thanks again, Swingdude.
     
  6. swingdude

    swingdude De' Island Buzzer

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    Here ya go.....pics tell a million..that setup is mint 2016-05-10 20.55.40.jpg 2016-05-10 20.55.08.jpg
     
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  7. swingdude

    swingdude De' Island Buzzer

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    Just letting you know I use a CT fixed pulley...but this setup works nice too....
     
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  8. ClimbHy

    ClimbHy Member

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    This is one of the best combos I have found with my short tether RW setup; Vortex with a IMGP0121.JPG 24" e2e AP 10mm 3x3 VT. It never binds, you can not make it bind, even with a long drop and sudden stop ,always a smooth release. And it always grabs, no manual setting ever, even after 100' + ascents.
     
  9. Levi.CO

    Levi.CO Well-Known Member

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    That setup is real nice, I dig the short tether, how long is that?
     
  10. ClimbHy

    ClimbHy Member

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    Thanks .The tether is 6 1/4" e2e. As short as I could go and still allow the RW to be in the neutral position while ascending.
     
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  11. TimBr

    TimBr Well-Known Member

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    Wow! That was quite a post! Thanks for sharing your formula!

    I do have a couple of questions for you with regard to your short tether. In the photo it looks as though you've combined some kind of metal piece on the bottom end of your tether with whatever cordage you happen to be using on the top end of your short tether. I looked, but could not find any posts by you that detail how it was that you constructed your Rope Wrench tether. Can you provide any more details about this?

    Also, looking at your photograph of how your tether is attached to your triple attachment pulley is confusing to me. It almost looks like you have some kind of hollow pin coming out the center of the bottom, metal end of your tether. To me that implies a flange, or raised edge exists on the pin, which keeps the tether from slipping off. I was wondering if I'm anywhere close in my description of your method of attachment for your tether to the pulley?

    It looks like it might be a really slick, quick-release system for the tether. Is there any way you could post a photo of the opposite side of your pulley? Maybe even a separate photo of the method of attachment, all by itself?

    Thanks in advance for any answers you choose to give.

    Tim
     
  12. ClimbHy

    ClimbHy Member

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    Yes Tim that's exactly it, Just a little metal piece I made ( shackle) that fits on the top hole of the HC pulley. Then just cordage , heat shrink or tape in between. The pin is close to the same diameter as the hole in the HC for a snug fit. I was originally going to try and make the pin with a detent or slick pin retainer but found that it stays in just fine with the washer welded on one end. At the moment I have to be real careful not to lose the pin when switching to DDRt but I could mitigate that with a drilling a hole and adding a little throw line to the pin. Another short hitch that works good with this settup is a 5 or 6 wrap 1 brade VT, or Hitchhiker knot as people call it.
    IMGP0029.JPG IMGP0030.JPG IMGP0105.JPG
     
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  13. swingdude

    swingdude De' Island Buzzer

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    Never understand why folks think that an ABR normal tether and a 28" stitched cord wrench setup is BIG and gets in the way....I find it funny....a wrench is such a great tool in a reg setup...but hey horses for courses
     
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  14. ClimbHy

    ClimbHy Member

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    I don't remember the extra length being a problem until I got a HitchHiker. Climbing on the HH-2 everyday for 6 months and then going back on the RW it just seemed to always be in the way. I guess I just got spoiled with the HH. But yes you are right, Not a problem at all for most people. But I am really liking my short RW now, and its great to have an extra system for DRT situations.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2016
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  15. JeffGu

    JeffGu Well-Known Member

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    I think it's just a body type thing... for some people it ends up hitting you right in the face a lot. Lot of variance with humans, as far as the ratio of torso to leg that makes up our height. Add to that all the different saddles, bridge configurations, etc. and I'm surprised that so much of this equipment works for so many people.
     
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  16. swingdude

    swingdude De' Island Buzzer

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    Jeff I think you are right here...at 6' the wrench has never been near my face...I run a short bridge and never climb DdRT...except the odd tail....HH never appealed to me...I am a singing tree dude....I just love a wrench....preference though
     
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  17. TimBr

    TimBr Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for posting all of the great photos of your setup, ClimbHy. So, there really is nothing but pressure from the tether cordage keeping that pin from slipping all of the way out of the hitch climber pulley then, if I'm understanding things correctly. I'd be afraid that if I rolled to the right, it would just fall right out. But you are finding that it stays right where you want it, no problem. Really interesting. Thanks again, and beautiful, robust looking work you've done there with that tether, all around.

    Tim
     
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  18. monkeylove

    monkeylove Well-Known Member

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    It would have a hard time working it's way out Tim, but even if it did there would not really be a problem per say. The RW is not really the life support, the hitch underneath it is. The hitch would bind up tight and might be rough to descend on but that it why we carry 8's or use mutters.
     
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  19. JeffGu

    JeffGu Well-Known Member

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    I think you might have been muttering when you typed that... :LOL:
     
  20. colb

    colb Well-Known Member

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    Can I get personal, @ClimbHy and ask how much you weigh?
     

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