.

rico

Well-Known Member
Hey, rico! I was just wondering if you use the Wrench or the Hitch Hiker in different situations, or is it just by how you are feeling on a particular day? It is a tough question that you may not wish to answer, but do you have a preference for one over the other, and if so, why is that the case? Just looking for the veteran climber's perspective. Thanks.

Tim
They are both just so nice I don't think I could pick one. The wrench is just so buttery smooth both up and down, but is not as compact as the HH for spar work. The HH2 is also capable of the same smoothness once dialed in, is a little more finacky at times, but has that compactness that I love. Both are absolutely bulletproof, super safe, trusty tools, and I would be quite happy flying either one for the duration of my climbing days.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
Someone asked earlier if the HH would work on 9mm rope. I tried it out with some 6mm cord, tied in a Knut H and it does work. Didn't need a wooded Cinch Samaritan because it released very easy. I was going to show a picture of that but wondered if it would work with 8mm Epicord as the climb line, and it did. The last test was the same 6mm cord on Mammut's 6mm rap cord. It needs two extra wraps, and twisting the hitch to descend, rather than pushing down on the top of the hitch, but does work nicely.IMG_2227.JPG
 

DSMc

Well-Known Member
Brocky, I would think that the percentage of the load being carried by the carabiner and dog bone is getting mighty low with those skinny lines.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
I agree, if you descend normally the load is mostly on the hitch. Twisting, rather pushing on the hitch, allows you to better regulate your descent. It's possible, but not practical with that small of diameter.
 

Bob Bob

Well-Known Member
Someone asked earlier if the HH would work on 9mm rope. I tried it out with some 6mm cord, tied in a Knut H and it does work. Didn't need a wooded Cinch Samaritan because it released very easy. I was going to show a picture of that but wondered if it would work with 8mm Epicord as the climb line, and it did. The last test was the same 6mm cord on Mammut's 6mm rap cord. It needs two extra wraps, and twisting the hitch to descend, rather than pushing down on the top of the hitch, but does work nicely.View attachment 55513
Excellent report @Brocky ! Any concern with the stopper knots and the dogbone with 6mm hitch cord?
 

Bob Bob

Well-Known Member
I shot this video a couple days ago. It seems appropriate to post it here. Nothing ground breaking but it does show the set-ups that have worked welI for me over the years. I welcome comments and suggestions on the systems I've demonstrated. Shout out to @DSMc for showing the pulley add on and for explaining the benefits of the knee ascender. Maybe some of the veteran climbers could show some of their set-ups also?
 

Batla

Member
I shot this video a couple days ago. It seems appropriate to post it here. Nothing ground breaking but it does show the set-ups that have worked welI for me over the years. I welcome comments and suggestions on the systems I've demonstrated. Shout out to @DSMc for showing the pulley add on and for explaining the benefits of the knee ascender. Maybe some of the veteran climbers could show some of their set-ups also?
It is always a pleasure to watch your videos Bob Bob! Explanations are crystal clear and the information delivered at a right pace.
One comment, actually two..
1- I love the twang of the Telecaster :guitarra: at the end of the film
2 - Why, when you use the hand ascender, don't you take the opportunity to lanyard it to your bridge?
 

DSMc

Well-Known Member
... I welcome comments and suggestions on the systems I've demonstrated...
Thanks for the shout out, Bob. With all the new stuff coming out it is nice to see the HH not getting lost in the shuffle. It is an incredibly good tool.
If you press the side plates of the pulley together so that they grab and hold your bridge ring, it will be much simpler and less fussy to set up.
When using a pulley on the bridge ring and using a knee and foot ascender, you can tend slack on a rope walk by simply clipping into the bridge ring. I no longer use a slack tending tether on the HH as it becomes redundant when using a pulley.
On the HH 1, there is enough room to put the tail of your hitch cord through the top part of the lower slot that the carabiner rides in. This will reduce how far the carabiner travels up thereby reducing stroke and set back.
 

Bob Bob

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the kind words @Batla! The music seemed to fit the footage well.

I have not tried attaching the hand ascender to the bridge ring but maybe I should give it a try. A climber could certainly do this with a short section of rope, cord or webbing. I think you can also tend or pull the hitchhiker up during ascent using a short tether attached to the hand ascender or just a loop as shown in this video.

I've seen a combination foot loop & tether (maybe called a cowstail?) with rope walking set-ups that only use mechanical ascenders (such as the Petzl Croll Chest ascender with a foot ascender and hand ascender). I think this video may show what I'm trying to describe.

A random video showing another set-up and tending solution.

Do you use a hand ascender tether with your set-up?
 

Bob Bob

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the shout out, Bob. With all the new stuff coming out it is nice to see the HH not getting lost in the shuffle. It is an incredibly good tool.
If you press the side plates of the pulley together so that they grab and hold your bridge ring, it will be much simpler and less fussy to set up.
When using a pulley on the bridge ring and using a knee and foot ascender, you can tend slack on a rope walk by simply clipping into the bridge ring. I no longer use a slack tending tether on the HH as it becomes redundant when using a pulley.
On the HH 1, there is enough room to put the tail of your hitch cord through the top part of the lower slot that the carabiner rides in. This will reduce how far the carabiner travels up thereby reducing stroke and set back.
I'm going to give your post a good study and experiment next time I'm out. Thanks for the suggestions and ideas.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
Great video, Bob! The stoppers in the 6mm cord seem to be big enough, plastic washers could be added for extra security.
 

Batla

Member
I'm going to give your post a good study and experiment next time I'm out. Thanks for the suggestions and ideas.
Thanks for the kind words @Batla! The music seemed to fit the footage well.

I have not tried attaching the hand ascender to the bridge ring but maybe I should give it a try. A climber could certainly do this with a short section of rope, cord or webbing. I think you can also tend or pull the hitchhiker up during ascent using a short tether attached to the hand ascender or just a loop as shown in this video.

I've seen a combination foot loop & tether (maybe called a cowstail?) with rope walking set-ups that only use mechanical ascenders (such as the Petzl Croll Chest ascender with a foot ascender and hand ascender). I think this video may show what I'm trying to describe.

A random video showing another set-up and tending solution.

Do you use a hand ascender tether with your set-up?
Usually I rope walk with a R/W, together with a home made knee ascender and a pantin. In that case the only safety device is the R/W hitch. I also sometimes use the MicroFrog SRT technique as described in the video with a slight difference; instead of using a hand ascender, I use a 'basic' from Petzl. The bottom hole of this basic is connected to my harness with a tether and the top hole to my right wrist with a short piece of cord. I can then use the same technique for the progression as with the R/W. I strictly alternate left hand/right leg with the other couple. This helps me keep my balance as my gravity center does not oscillate from left to right too much.
Using both hands together to raise the ascender, as demonstrated in the video, is more tiring. At least for me..

The MicroFrog technique has pros and cons. It is fast to install, 2 safety features (croll + basic), no sit back . The biggest disadvantage is the conversion to limb walk or descend.
 
Last edited:

rico

Well-Known Member
@rico, Thanks for taking the time to answer, and answer so well. It is much appreciated. I hope you had a happy Thanksgiving celebration.

Tim
My pleasure Timbr. You really should be the official greeter for all new incoming TB members. Welcoming, easy going, helpful, and genuinely kind. Things we should all aspire to be. I’m smart enough to know that it ain’t ever gonna happen for me, but one can always wish. Keep doing what you do, and being who you are bro.
 

Burrapeg

Well-Known Member
Someone asked earlier if the HH would work on 9mm rope. I tried it out with some 6mm cord, tied in a Knut H and it does work. Didn't need a wooded Cinch Samaritan because it released very easy . . .
Sounds encouraging! A rock climbing friend gave me a big chunk of new 9.1mm Bluewater Icon which is really tough stuff but I have not gotten my ZZ/RW combo or BDB to work on it reliably. They simply cannot handle the small diameter. I am amazed at how light this bag of skinny rope is! If I hike any distance to a tree, it would be great to use this lightweight stuff. I might try a HH2 if it seems to work OK with the smaller ropes. It would be nice to ascend SRS and swap over to MRS once in the canopy. The catalogues suggest the HH is great for that. Any of you have further thoughts on the HH2 and rec climbing with skinny rope?
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
I looked at your rope and it is very dynamic, which might mean squishy, even with a thicker cover. Hitches might bite too hard with that type of rope. I have a hunch that the HH might not be best for softer ropes. For rec climbing an alternative for that size of rope is the Mammut Smart 2.0. It needs ascenders above it, but it has always grabbed. It also works with the 6mm rope when it is twinned through it.
 

Burrapeg

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply, Brocky. Actually this Icon 9.1mm rope cables up a bit under load and gets rather stiff. It is not very soft at all. It seems to get mixed reviews online because of that. I was surprised at how hard it felt the first few times I played around with it and put my weight on it trying my BDB out on it (fitted a bigger diameter bollard but that didn't help much with the slippage). If I use one of these Mammut devices, I assume it is mainly for progress capture and braking while rappelling? How would it fit in with ascent with my foot and knee ascenders? I can't get my mind around how I would use it with rope walking unless both ascenders were above the thing as you said (and I was using long foot loops?). The price is right though, thirty-something$. And it looks like it is very quick to attach to the rope.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
You can’t use ascenders below the Smart, so no rope walking. I use an ascender with footloops above it for a sit-stand system. If that rope is that stiff, it sounds like it would be okay to use with the HH. The Oval VT hitch would also be a light weight option.
 

Burrapeg

Well-Known Member
You can’t use ascenders below the Smart, so no rope walking. I use an ascender with footloops above it for a sit-stand system. If that rope is that stiff, it sounds like it would be okay to use with the HH. The Oval VT hitch would also be a light weight option.
The oval VT is the one with the ring or biner and overhand knot? I think I kept the photo on my Mac desktop somewhere (really cluttered). We have some sunshine back today so I will try that out after lunch in my big backyard cedar. Thanks, Brocky.
 
Top